Stronger CV's and Diffs

NDMORETIME · 04-08-2007, 03:48 PM

First off don't flame me yet. I have searched and read for the last few days and there doesn't seem to be much that will strengthen these parts of an IFS setup. I am not at a level yet to do a SAS so I am looking for a way to strengthen parts that might break.

Has anyone had there parts CRYO TREATED. There was a thread that discussed this but I can't seem to locate it. It was also discussed in a 4 wheel drive magazine I just read at Borders. They claim they can do CV, DIFFS, pretty much anything that is medal. They are claiming as much as a 50% increase in strength. According to this website it doesn't seem to me to be very expensive over the long run. Maybe if you just do it as the parts break or something. Just looking for some feedback from anyone who has done this or from someone who knows someone who has. The website for the company is www.cryoscience.com I think.

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**Lysmachia** · 04-08-2007, 04:15 PM

I am sure there are cryotreated CV's - But I don't know where you would get them. (tc mentioned maybe Steve Schaffer does them at sonoran steel). But diff's? Do you mean gears inside the diff's? If so I definitely know that those can be bought for sure at many places that sell gears - in fact you can choose the gears you want done and they will have it done for you.

This page (Zuk's Gear Installs) http://www.gearinstalls.com/ has some examples of cryo installed gears. He can get cryo gears ordered and installed for you.

More info on Cryo http://www.procryo.com/RemGears.html (The other link on Zuk's page was broken)

Cryo-treatment is an excellent way to get more strength. When I have to redo my 5.71's I will definitely have them cryo'd. It is a small price to pay for a lot of extra strength. I just installed cryo'd longfields too.

4Crawler · 04-08-2007, 04:18 PM

I had my new ring/pinion gear set in my VW transaxle cryo treated at http://www.nwcryo.com/ before I had it installed. Pretty easy to send them the parts and they do their magic and send them back.

**Lysmachia** · 04-08-2007, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Crawler

I had my new ring/pinion gear set in my VW transaxle cryo treated at http://www.nwcryo.com/ before I had it installed. Pretty easy to send them the parts and they do their magic and send them back.

See I knew someone like Roger would chime in with the answer!

That might have been the site link that was broken on Zuk's web site....

NDMORETIME · 04-08-2007, 08:05 PM

Thanks for the replies guys. Is there any way to send a CV axle to a company like this and have it done. The boots would have to be removed but it doesn't look they can be replaced after the treatment. Anybody else seen or installed a front axle that has been CRYO'ed.

sschaefer3 · 04-11-2007, 08:05 PM

My red truck has Cryoed front axles. There were a lot of industry "hook ups" to get it done.

http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=104077

ornery · 04-11-2007, 11:24 PM

How to remove CV Boots:

http://www.keystonekrawlers.com/Mods...eplacement.htm

Sounds like a great plan man.. The cryoscience.com site said 25 bucks and up for cryotreating CVs? ...for 50% increase in strength? Sign me up!

sschaefer3 · 04-12-2007, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ornery

How to remove CV Boots:

http://www.keystonekrawlers.com/Mods...eplacement.htm

Sounds like a great plan man.. The cryoscience.com site said 25 bucks and up for cryotreating CVs? ...for 50% increase in strength? Sign me up!

This is where I disconnect from this. Removing the boots is the least of your concerns. It is separating the outer CV from the center shaft without destroying it and cleaning all of the grease out where the fun begins, not ends, but begins.

All I can say it I had it done, I can't help any more than that. If you want to pursue it, it can be done.

ornery · 04-12-2007, 04:53 PM

After a little more research:

"Researchers have found that the effects of shallow cryogenic tempering (-110 degF) is minimal unless it is performed as part of the initial heat treat cycle. Heat treating is what gives steel it’s hardness as well as it’s toughness, wear resistance and ductility. Even performed properly, heat treating cannot remove all of the retained austenite ( large unstable particles of carbon carbide ) from a steel. Proper heat treating is a key part in increasing a part’s toughness, durability, wear resistance, strength and Rockwell hardness."

http://www.iwt.com.au/cryogenics.htm

Unless you can buy manufactured cryo'd CV's it seems to be almost pointless.. Oh well.

1-0 for SAS, haha.

BruceTS · 04-15-2007, 03:18 PM

Typically the cage inside the CV breaks first, then the pieces lodge causing the rest to fail. The star is the next to crack..... I've broken front axles, just about every way possible. Sheared the center axle shaft twice, busted the inner CV cage, busted the outer CV cage, busted an outer CV star. Also broke the Jackshaft inside the diff.

Now the issue at hand, how to make things stronger without going SAS. If you strengthen the axles you move your break point to the diff, most likely the jackshaft, if you strengthen this then the 7.5" gearset becomes the weak link, of course this is if you already have an ARB air locker, otherwise your weak link is the spider gears.

For me I will keep my weak link the axles, much easier to replace if broken....

potsy · 04-16-2007, 10:28 AM

Quote:

If you strengthen the axles you move your break point to the diff, most likely the jackshaft, if you strengthen this then the 7.5" gearset becomes the weak link, of course this is if you already have an ARB air locker, otherwise your weak link is the spider gears.

For me I will keep my weak link the axles, much easier to replace if broken....

good point.

SteveO · 04-16-2007, 10:51 AM

I used to have the ORS heavy duty 1/2 shafts. I broke 3 of them. I then exploded a CV joint. You might be better of just carrying a couple spare shafts. I believe Carquest has a warranty on their IFS shafts. Break it, take it back for another.

04-08-2007, 04:18 PM	#3 (permalink)
4Crawler Contributing Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SF Bay Area, CA Posts: 7,832	I had my new ring/pinion gear set in my VW transaxle cryo treated at http://www.nwcryo.com/ before I had it installed. Pretty easy to send them the parts and they do their magic and send them back. __________________ 1985 Toyota 4Runner SR-5, 22REC engine, dual t-cases, 4.88 gears, dual ARBs, 33x10.50 BFGs or 35x12.50 MTRs r.c.brown@ieee.org TruckEditor@tlca.org Project: 4Crawler 4Crawler OffRoad Gettin'Off 4WD Club

04-11-2007, 08:05 PM	#6 (permalink)
sschaefer3 Contributing Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tempe, Arizona Posts: 5,494	My red truck has Cryoed front axles. There were a lot of industry "hook ups" to get it done. http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=104077 __________________ Steve Schaefer *WWW.SonoranSteel.Com* Suspension Lift Kits * Rock Sliders * Straight Axle Conversions * 4Runner/FJC Rubicon Express Lower Links * Accessories * Daystar Products Dealer * TJM Bull Bar Dealer * Deaver Leaf Spring Dealer * Tokico & Bilstein Shock Dealer * ViAir Dealer * Total Chaos Dealer * TOYTEC Dealer * and like everyone else a Trail Gear Dealer

04-16-2007, 10:51 AM	#12 (permalink)
SteveO Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: NM Posts: 1,848	I used to have the ORS heavy duty 1/2 shafts. I broke 3 of them. I then exploded a CV joint. You might be better of just carrying a couple spare shafts. I believe Carquest has a warranty on their IFS shafts. Break it, take it back for another. __________________ http://www.Hunt4Steve.com In the span of time, life is short. Our life is like a wave on the ocean, a flower in the field, here today and gone tomorrow. Know yourself, know where you will spend eternity, for NOTHING else will matter when you die.

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04-08-2007, 08:05 PM	#5 (permalink)
NDMORETIME Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 25	Thanks for the replies guys. Is there any way to send a CV axle to a company like this and have it done. The boots would have to be removed but it doesn't look they can be replaced after the treatment. Anybody else seen or installed a front axle that has been CRYO'ed.

04-11-2007, 11:24 PM	#7 (permalink)
ornery Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: BC, Canada Posts: 154	How to remove CV Boots: http://www.keystonekrawlers.com/Mods...eplacement.htm Sounds like a great plan man.. The cryoscience.com site said 25 bucks and up for cryotreating CVs? ...for 50% increase in strength? Sign me up!

04-12-2007, 04:53 PM	#9 (permalink)
ornery Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: BC, Canada Posts: 154	After a little more research: "Researchers have found that the effects of shallow cryogenic tempering (-110 degF) is minimal unless it is performed as part of the initial heat treat cycle. Heat treating is what gives steel it’s hardness as well as it’s toughness, wear resistance and ductility. Even performed properly, heat treating cannot remove all of the retained austenite ( large unstable particles of carbon carbide ) from a steel. Proper heat treating is a key part in increasing a part’s toughness, durability, wear resistance, strength and Rockwell hardness." http://www.iwt.com.au/cryogenics.htm Unless you can buy manufactured cryo'd CV's it seems to be almost pointless.. Oh well. 1-0 for SAS, haha.

04-15-2007, 03:18 PM	#10 (permalink)
BruceTS Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 2,317	Typically the cage inside the CV breaks first, then the pieces lodge causing the rest to fail. The star is the next to crack..... I've broken front axles, just about every way possible. Sheared the center axle shaft twice, busted the inner CV cage, busted the outer CV cage, busted an outer CV star. Also broke the Jackshaft inside the diff. Now the issue at hand, how to make things stronger without going SAS. If you strengthen the axles you move your break point to the diff, most likely the jackshaft, if you strengthen this then the 7.5" gearset becomes the weak link, of course this is if you already have an ARB air locker, otherwise your weak link is the spider gears. For me I will keep my weak link the axles, much easier to replace if broken....