ebelen1

I have a '99 4runner and just swapped out shocks, installed a Revtek lift and got new rims and tires within the last month.

After the shocks and lift (w/ stock wheels), I didn't notice a big deal with play in my steering. After the new tires, I started noticing more play in the steering (mostly when driving on the freeway taking turns).

I've searched threads and what seems to be the problem with this is not a steering stabilizer but probably tie rods. My question is when do tie rods normally go out and is this the only thing I should look into. My mechanic says that the lift and change in center of gravity may require an upgrading steering stabilizer but this seems to not make sense based on my research.

Let me know.

noahrexion

thats because you have rack n pinion

However it could be the tie rod ends. Get your butt under the truck and check the condition of the tie rod ends (where they bolt to hub), check sway bar buschings/endlinks as well.

4RunnerFever

Where is the steering stabilizer on a 3rd gen? I don't think there is one that you could upgrade.

I'd guess tie rod ends, but the sway bar bushings might be gone as well.

good luck

spacewrangler

you may also want to check your steering rack bushings. if they haven't been replaced, they're probably going to be worn out by now.

ebelen1

Thanks guys. I'll tell my mechanic what you said and go from there. I can go under the truck and look at stuff but I wouldn't know what a bushing is or a tie rod. I do know what a shock looks like but that's about it.

LittleRedToyota

the generations between pickups and 4 runners don't match.

the 3rd gen pickup is the last years of the pre-tacoma pickup (about the same time frame as 2nd gen runner, i think) and uses recirculated ball steering. it does have a steering stabilizer (aka shimmy shock, aka the parallel mounted shock absorber at the front). it could be upgraded (or at least replaced with an aftermarket one...not sure if it would amount to an upgrade.)

3rd gen 4runner uses, i think, rack-and-pinion steering (at least tacos from the same years do), so the setup is completely different.


EDIT: nevermind...i see the original poster has a runner also...somehow i thought i was in a different thread and the guy was asking about a 3rd gen pickup...sorry about that....where's the :i'm an idiot: smiley guy

Crux

I replaced the steering rack bushing and the inner and outer tie rods.
Helped my steering a bunch.
It's still a little loose, but that's prob because the tires aren't balanced correctly or my rack has play inside it.

MTL_4runner

People often mistake the steering rack bushings going out for tie rod problems.
Get someone to yank on the wheel while you are watching for play in the rack, tie rods and bushings.
The inner tie rods are tough to see play, you need to put your hand on the boot and feel for play there.

ebelen1

Thanks for the feedback. I'll look into these as possible problems.

ebelen1

Bringing this post back because I've (well my mechanic) checked under the truck and al bushings, tie rods, etc. are fine and tight. I had him drive the truck on the freeway and let him feel the "play" I was talking about earlier in the post at speeds >70 mph. Although the truck was just aligned and it drives straight, it feels like the steering wheel can be moved left or right at these high speeds w/no truck movement (left or right. It's fine at lower speeds or when you're going straight but when you hit a bump or the road is curving, it's a little unsettling.

After all this ranting, my mechanic has a theory that if my camber is positive, this may be the cause of the "play" I'm trying to describe. He also thinks that you can't really adjust camber unless there is a specific kit for our trucks. He said that some places may bend the strut to straighten the camber but this sounds a little weird for me. Anyone else with this experience? Can my camber be adjusted?

Thanks.

Localmotion

i actually had the same problem as you did. My problem ended up being the outer tie rod. Took it to a shop fixed it right up. Also i had a problem with my alignment, too much toe in. maybe you just need to break in your new suspension? did you get a diff drop? I remember when i first lifted my rig with some OME 881s, i was swaying all over the place. Now was it bc i didnt haev a diff drop? i dont know. I ended up getting around 3 inches of lift from it. Now i have the tundra set up, with diff drop and no sway at all. hope this helps.

BTW: try jacking up each front wheel and try to shake it up and down and side to side. If you hear a click or if it moves, then u need to tie rods. I know you said the mechanic already looked at it, but its something simple to double check

ebelen1

I don't have a diff drop b/c I have a 4X2. The truck was actually on the rack when he showed me that the tie rods and various bushings were OK. He tugged on a bunch of stuff and everything was tight.

How long should I give the suspension to settle? The weird thing is I only started feeling the play after the new rims and tires (I upgraded to 16" wheels and 265/75/16 tires). I'll give it another couple of weeks and bring it back to the alignment shop. Thanks for the help.

MTL_4runner

The taller tires can often add to the play in the steering because of the taller sidewall which allows the tire to flex more. If everything is tight (tie rods, bushings, wheel bearings, etc) then that may be the cause. I have not seen this on my 4runner but my Honda Civic had a similar issue when I put on tires with a taller sidewall.....made the steering so sloppy I switched them back. Switching brands of tires can also affect it since tire construction and stiffness can vary as well.

ebelen1

This is exactly what my mechanic told me. He had a friend that had Dunlops on a Civic and no matter what he did, the steering was sloppy. This guy swapped the Dunlops and had no further issues. Not gonna happen for me b/c I just bought a new set of tires (Geolanders if anyone's interested).

noahrexion

great choice mate If you want pics of 265/75's on my runner then just do a search for "geolanders" on the board and you should see mine (97').

Hope it works out for you, I have no steering issues with my runner at all.

bamachem

it's the alignment.

4RunnerFever

I agree, try to find a shop with the Hunter alignment machine.

ebelen1

bamachem is the man. Went back to the alignment shop and explained my issue. They checked the alignment again and found that the camber was negative while the casper was positive. Don't really know what this means technically but this was causing my steering issue.

Realigned and drove on the freeway for a short bit and it seems to have been fixed. Also got the steering wheel lined up appropriately.

Thanks again.

bamachem

camber is the "tilt" of the wheel. it either tilts in at the top or tilts in at the bottom. slight tilt in at the top is desirable.

caster is what makes it drive straight on the freeway and keeps the steering tight. notice on a shopping cart how the front wheels will turn in whatever direction you turn the buggy? that's because the center of rotation of the wheels trails the pivot point of the steering axis. you want a slight negative caster ( wheel bearing trails the upper ball joint). this makes steering very solid feeling at high speeds - as long as the camber and toe are properly adjusted.

toe - think of it as pigeon toed or crows feet... its the angle of relation of the two front wheels when looking from above. if they are like / \, then the toe is negative. if they are like \ /, then the toe is positive. too much of either is bad and will cause VIBRATIONS - no matter what someone else may tell you - BAD TOE CAN AND WILL CAUSE VIBRATIONS LIKE AN OUT-OF-BALANCE WHEEL.

to get a PROPER ALIGNMENT, you need to get the camber set first. on a 3rd gen, you do that by moving the front and rear lower cam adjustments until (rear is in more and front is out more) you create a situation where the contact patch of the tire is physically behind the axis of rotation created by the upper and lower ball joints. then, you get the camber set (moving front and rear the same amounts to keep the caster set) so you have a ever-so-slight tilt inward at the top (1 degree or less usually), then you recheck your camber. after all that, then you adjust the tie end rods with the steering wheel centered to get the toe set so the tires run parallel to each other, then you check all three again to verify that they're correct. if any are even slightly out of spec, then you start over. most shops don't care to do it correctly, and that's why you get drift, poor highway feel, and vibrations. our 3rd gens are very sensitive to alignment issues, so if it doesn't feel good, then it's out of alignment. when a 3rd gen is done properly, then it feels AWESOME on the road.

ebelen1

Exactly what he said...

It's pretty awesome to have the guys on this board chime in and have such detailed knowledge about almost every problem I've read about. Thanks.