KrashDH

So this has been developing over the last week, but it's not bad. The starter Has been replaced in the truck , so it is aftermarket, but it wasn't me who did it.

Lately, it seems (only once in a while) that when I go to turn the truck over, I hear a "click". So, I try to turn it over again immediately after this and the truck starts fine. The starter NEVER struggles to start the truck though.

And it is intermittent. It's not like this "click" is consistent. Most of the time it starts right up. My roomate had his starter go out, and his struggled, it lugged 6 or seven times before it would catch...sometimes it wouldn't. Also, if I use the clutch start cancel, I have never had this issue; 2 times and it catches. So it makes me think the starter is ok...

So I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas where to start (no pun intended) on diagnosing this issue. I have checked (so I think) the majority of my electrical connections and they all seem tight. Anyone have any ideas? Thanks

ETRNL

you get to do what i am doing at 5:30 tomorrow morning.. changing the starter contacts!!!
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f2/3...-heavy-105098/

gtlegs

Try this: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...ht=starter+fix

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

See below:
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...shtml#EasyTest

KrashDH

Hey guys thanks for the replies and links. From what I gather it seems this weekend I will be attempting to pull the starter and changing those contacts. Are they something I can get at the dealership or is it better to go through an auto parts store? Also does anyone have advice on specific tools or extensions I may need? I have a decent collection but anything to help make this easier on myself...

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

How to get to the starter:
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...rter.shtml#Fix

You can get the contacts though the dealer, but they are usually special order items (so allow for that time) and expensive. Also available below:
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...OnlineOrdering

KrashDH

Another question, so I talked to the dealer, they wanted $26 for the kit (both contacts, bolts and nuts). Is this worth it or should I just get the contacts from the 4crawler site and then sport for a plunger as well, because upon reading people have said if the plunger is scored it will wear new contacts faster...yet I know many have just opted for the contacts and been fine...

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

Plunger is usually good for many decades of use, mine is 24 years old and still works fine. If dirty, just clean up the ring with some steel wool or sand paper and it'll be fine. The plunger rotates with each start cycle so a fresh part of the ring hits the contacts. That is why it'll out wear the contacts many times over.

KrashDH

Ok that's what I was thinking too...the wire brush method. So is it worth it to get the kit then (bolts, nuts, and contacts)? Sorry for all the posts just trying to get some info since this will be my first go at this. I can already feel my knuckle starting to bleed tryin to get that thing out

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

When I first replaced mine, I got the dealer kit and found it was easier to just replace the contacts rather that try and remove/replace the studs and other parts. If your hardware is damaged (like a nut stripped out) then the dealer kit is the way to go. If you just want the parts that wear out, get the contacts.

KrashDH

I think om my truck though you have to take the bolt out to get the contact out...from what it looks like the nut is on the outside of the housing and the contact is held down by the head of the bolt...

KrashDH

So, I pulled my starter today. I followed some guidelines but because of this location and the sizes of peoples arms etc, I believe everyone has a different way of getting it out.

Here is what I did, with some included photos.

I left the wheel on and turned it towards the passenger side.
I was able to disconnect the harness plug from the bottom, and was able to get the battery nut off from the wheel well (with the rubber protector out).
i then was able to remove that bottom bolt with a 14mm deep socket from underneath the truck looking up.
The top nut was a bit more tricky. I used the same deep socket and just barely got it on the bolt head. I used my left hand to keep pressure on it, and I was able to loosen the nut one click of the ratchet at a time. i know not efficient, but it worked.
The only issue was as I was loosening the top bolt, the weight of the starter motor meant that it was keeping pressure on that top bolt. Once I got it loosened so there was motor play, i yanked the front wheel and was able to balance the starter to allow me to remove the top bolt by hand. This worked great. I worked the motor out of the wheel well opening and I DID NOT have to bend anything.

I included a picture to show the orientation of getting it out, as for future attempts at this might be made easier.
Also included is a picture of the contacts. The non-battery side looks fine as can be seen, but the battery side has the notorious "machined" looking groove.

Here is a question I have, even though I am getting new contacts. you can see on the battery contact (left) the teeth mark from the bolt (in the center of the opening). Whats to stop you from adjusting where this bolt sits in the opening to match it with the other contact (so they are level)? This way the contact could be re-used again. i'm assuming that is why they have oval openings for the bolt, or am I wrong?

Also, is the best way to re install these contacts so each bolt is close enough in the center of the oval as possible, so the plunger hits each evenly? Or should they be off set a bit because the battery side seems to wear MUCH quicker...

Anyway, the plunger contact was a bit pitted, so I will be taking a wire brush to it. I still haven't decided if I want to replace the non-battery side contact because it looks with a little cleaning up, it is still good.

Anyway, pictures and also any advice on the reinstall of the contacts would be awesome!

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

You want the contacts to sit level. You can try shimming up the worn one, should work for a while. My theory on the wear is that the battery side sees the initial arc of current as the plunger moves towards the contacts. Since that side of the circuit only has the battery and the big starter power cable. The motor side of the circuit has the inductance of the motor windings, so that probably helps to dampen out the arc on that side. But in any event, I would guess that for 95%-99% of the life of the contacts, they look identical. But at some point, one of the contacts (about 99% of the time the battery side) starts to get pitted. Once that happens, it progressively gets worse and as the copper wears away, the arcing gets worse and the erosion increases even faster. So you might have say 150K-200K miles of trouble-free operation and then in the last few thousand miles, the starter acts up, at first only once a month, then once a week, then once a day then every time you try and start the engine.

I pulled my starter out a few years back (about 10 yrs/100K miles) after replacing the contacts and both look identical, a little dirty but no visible wear.

KrashDH

So upon re installing should I just make sure the bolts are in the center of those ovals then? Is there a way to check if they are level?

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

I push the contacts all the way down then tighten the nuts. I doubt the bolt alone would hold the contact up off the bottom without something below to support them, with the repeated impact of the plunger hitting the contacts. I have heard of folks using thin strips of metal or plastic to shim up a worn contact to level it with the other one. But you can check by pushing the plunger in and see if it goes in and hits both contacts or if it has to tip slightly to hit both.

KrashDH

All the way down you mean so they are essentially at the top of the ovals? The only thing I'm wondering about that is if they do start to wear, can the plunger keep going down even though they are at the lowest setting? Or do you mean at the bottom of the ovals so it would take less travel for the plunger to make contact...?

You can see in my photo where the battery contact was sitting...right in the middle of that oval because you can see the teeth marks from the bolt (there are teeth just below the bolt head...It seems as if the bolt held on the battery side and the motor side could have been slipping...I only think this because the teeth may have held that battery side fine, and the motor side was slipping...because there is no groove, so essentially it wore a groove in the battery side while pushing the motor side down? Just a theory.

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

I was referring to pushing the contacts down to the base of the solenoid so they sit flush to that flat area.

KrashDH

So, got the starter back in today wasn't too bad actually.. Was able to do it w/o a hand from anyone.

NO parts store in this town would sell me contacts. They wanna gouge you for a new starter. So, I went into the dealership. Apparently, my starter is aftermarket and not a Yota one anymore So, the contacts he had (just the battery one) was not the same. It actually had a bigger surface area, but still same shape. So, I bought the set anyway. $25 for both sets (bolts, nuts, gaskets, etc...). They fit fine, and they seem to be made a bit nicer than the contacts in there.

Took me about 45 min to put everything all back together. The one key thing if you do it they way I described is that to finish tightening the top nut, the wheel needs to be put back on and lowered to the ground (not on a jackstand like when removing). By doing this it increased the space between the wheel well and the tranny housing and I could get the ratchet in there.

Connected the battery cable back up and she started like a dream. No clicks!