pld15

Is the newer 2.7L as dependable and long lasting as the 22re? I am looking at some 90's toytotas and trying to decide what to replace my '88 4x4 with. I love my 22re and I want to know if I am going to be diappointed if i get 2.7L instead of a 22re. I think the switch was 1996? Any input would be appreciated.

skshepherd

Bought my 95 with 125k miles on it and now have 206k miles and have only had to do regular oil changes and tune ups. 95 tacoma was the switch, you will appreciate the power increase of the 2.7 and I get 20-24mpg. Not sure what the 22re's get. Plus if you want to change out the front rotors you do not have to disassemble the hub and axle to do so like on the older models.

kyle_22r

from all i've seen, the 2.7 is no disappointment. lives up to the 22RE's name, with 160hp to boot

bktaco

bought my 2000 excab 4wd new, put 20K mi/yr on it (total 80k today), plenty offroad, also my commuter. i follow the service schedule (including a drain interval of 5k miles for engine oil and filter). the truck runs like it did on day one. no problems whatsoever.

as noted above, a bit more power in this truck (actually 150 max hp i think it is, versus the 116 for the 22re). it is reasonably powerful, but not a powerhouse for towing loads or grades. pulls me and my lady and our gear well enough between the western states and mexico. does not get the incredible 34 mpg that i actually achieved regularly in a 84 toy 2wd, but you can squeeze 22 to 24 mpg on the highway, downhill with a tailwind.

for perspective, i have had 5 toy trucks since the mid 80's - wouldnt think about getting anything else. i had the same worries you have now when i shopped this truck out. i think we are beginning to see that the 3RZ is a general improvement from the 22R line. cheers!

tenfourtyeight

There is even a supercharger for the 2.7. That would be enough reason for me. Although, it's a tradeoff, the early weak engines with strong ass frames, or new more powerful engines, with weaker frames.

mikedog

Are we actually seeing 3RZ's achieving over 400K/500K/600K+ miles though? The 20r/22r, I believe, are THE most reliable and dependable engines Toyota ever made. The 20r/22r are relatively simple low tech engines. This low tech simple approach made these motors extremely durable. Not much STUFF to go wrong as they say.LOL!

I've always thought the 22r was considered more reliable than the 22re because of its simple induction system. No injectors to foul up. No TPS to fail. No IAC to get clogged up. No smog/air pump (certain 22r's only). No airflow meters. No electric fuel pump to fail and no fuel pressure regulator to go bad. Isn't the 22r generally regarded as a more durable and reliable motor than the 22re?

The 3RZ is alot more complex than the 22r and to some degree even the 22re. You got twin overhead cams. Distributorless coil on plug ignition system. Sophisticated engine control computer etc. etc. You know, all those electronic engine controls that like to give you problems as the vehicle ages and the engine racks up miles. However, Toyota's do seem to have bullit-proof electronics though.LOL!

Yes, the 3RZ has 150hp, but isn't that because it has "dual" overhead cams rather than one cam like the 22re? Also, the 2.4 to 2.7 displacement difference is probably good for another 15-20hp don't you think?

Remember, I'm just trying to be a devil's advocate here in looking at the 3RZ to 22r/22re comparision that's all.LOL!

amusement

i like the 2.7L because of provides 150 hp. That's the same as my 3vze. But, like any 4cyl engine you must understand it's limitations. Towing (as suggested above) should be limited to light loads. The supercharger is expensive. I think its a little over 2,000 US dollars. It adds another 40hp. I say, if you need 190hp then consider a v6.

If you have an inexpensive 22RE I would consider a supercharger for it. There's several superchargers that will work and the cost is less than 1,000 US dollars.

I have owned the 2.4 DOHC Taco. I liked the 26 mpg and the ability to run fast on straight and level roads. It had about 142hp. Going up 10 degree slops was a real job. Had to go down to 3rd gear (manaul transmission) and wind it up to 4,500 rpm to get up them.

Highland Runner

I've had two trucks with the 22re and a Tacoma with the 2.7. The difference is night and day. As far as reliability, the 2.7 is probably much more so than the 22re. The 2.7 was made to replace the 22re and its problems (mostly breaking timing chains). The early 20r had a double chain. The 22re had a single chain with plastic guides. Very Bad. The chains on one of my 22re trucks broke (yes I did maintain them).
I got twice the mileage from the 2.7 than I did with the 22re's.
The early 2.7's (95.5-97) had a distributor with the coil/ignitor/rotor inside.
The 2.7 has a larger filter and a non restrictive AFM unlike the 22re's vane valve.
After having the 2.7 I wouldn't even consider going back to a 22re. If I remember right there is a guy on TTORA with over 500,000 miles on his 2.7. Nothing more than oil changes.

Krash

Where? I would rather keep my 22re with a supercharger than fool with the 900$ I'm thinking about paying for a JDM 5m-gte and then the pita of a swap.

kyle_22r

i'd also love to find a $1000 supercharger i know lc makes them for the 22R and 22RE, and they also make a 22R turbo kit. all are around $2200-$2500 though.

i think the reason we aren't seeing many 3RZFE(gotta differentiated from the carbed 3RZF in a few countries ) with 300k miles is because the engine isn't even 10 years old. the 20R first came out in 1975, and the 22R came out in 1981, they've had time to acumulate all those miles

also, early(96-97 i think) 3RZFE engines had a distributor instead of coil packs. i know the motor can be carbed, there is a carbed version in production in nepal and some african countries. all you'd need to do would be to either get a factory manifold or fabricate your own, and install a distributor. knowing toyota, the bosses to mount the dist. would probably still be on the head. could be an interesting swap for someone like me who has an old truck, all you'd have to deal with after setting up your induction would be to route the exhaust(oddly enough, other countries with the 3RZ still route the exhaust to the driver side unlike the tacoma) and fabricate engine mounts

Nic

My Tacoma has 121,000 miles on it and it runs like a new one. I know that's not many miles for a Toyota, but hopefully it will be as good as my 84 Camry's engine (2S-E). I have put almost 300,000 miles on it and it have had to do very little to it over the years.

I have complete faith in Toyota's four cylinders. My first car was a 77 Corolla and it had a 3k series (1166 cc) engine and it was a reliable little vehicle. I racked a lot of miles up on it before I got rid of it.

mikedog

Do the 3RZFE's have a different timing chain and guides than the 22RE? I would think it would still be a single width chain with plastic guides just like the previous 22r/re. Did they beef them up with metal-backed guides and thicker chains or something for the 2RZFE/3RZFE?

Kyle, yeah, that's the ticket! A 3RZF with DOHC, driver's side exhaust and a simple carburator induction system. Man, now you got me wishing. Can't we get any group purchases going here to import a few 3RZF motors for us 22r guys? Also, did they ever make a 3RZFE in a turbo application for the world market? That would be an awesome engine!

What makes the 3RZFE a night and day difference than the 22r/re? I think someone up top mentioned that. Except for the DOHC which gives you a flatter torque curve, slightly larger displacement and better head geometry design I would think the differences wouldn't be that drastic. I mean we're talking 4cyl to 4cyl here, not 4cyl to 8cyl Tundra difference.LOL!

kyle_22r

call me crazy, but i think the *rz uses a belt instead of a chain.

as for carbing one, i don't think you'd have to import the whole engine, just the intake manifold and the distributor, i believe the engines are the same in just about every other way

flecker

Yata yata yata.... what you really need is the rare 22rv supercharged fuel injected carbureted motor. It produces 385 horses and 500 ft. lbs of torque! I know a guy who might get one.

Highland Runner

Difference in night and day, because of power and mileage mostly. I had the same truck (93 x-cab 4x4 vs 95 x-cab 4x4) and I could use 4th and 5th with the 2.7. The mileage was almost exactly twice with the 2.7 compared to the 22re. Even though the 22re is a good engine, the chains have a bad habit of breaking because of poor guide design. When I was on TTORA many guys had very high miles on the 2.7. We all kept asking when the timing chains need replacing and got no definate answer at the time from the dealers. It was like they didn't need to be. I had almost 200k on mine when I sold it to my sister in law 2 years ago. It still runs like new. The oil filter is also super easy to get to on the 2.7. The engine bay just seems less cluttered just like comparing a 3.0 to a 3.4.

kenandjenn

I have a 2000 Prerunner with the 2.7L and while I wish I had a V-6, the 2.7L does get the job done. Mine has 86,000 miles on it and runs perfectly. Before the Tacoma, I had a 92 Nissan SE 4X4 with the 3.0 V-6 and a Ford Ranger Edge 3.0 v-6. My Tacoma with the 2.7L will outrun both and gets MUCH better gas mileage. I see around 22-23 mpg with mine.

Brendan

22re get 19mpg in the city

kyle_22r

i think the 20R(and early 22R engines, '81 and '82 or so) were better built than the 22RE. they had double roller timing chains and steel guides

Highland Runner

kyle 22r-Yep, the 20R, 22r up to 82 had the double chain/steel guide.

Both 22re's I had never got over 14MPG on the highway. This may have to do with living at 4000 ft also. The 22re's had to be floored most of the time to get up hills.
The 2.7 got 24 MPG most of the time in the same conditions.

deathrunner

Will the 2.7 mate up to my 22re transmission and fit inside my engine bay 89 4runner????