22RE Replacement Options

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 05:58 PM

Well, I figured I would go ahead and start picking the brains of the wizards on this forum and heavily researching this through and through before I make a solid decision.

Not now, but in probably a year - year and a half I will be retiring the 22RE in my '90 P/U (as it is CURRENTLY pushing 208K), and I have been considering a couple of swaps... And yes, it will be a Toyota motor. To me, putting any other mfr's motor in a Toy is just heresy... Except for that fella Upndair's rig, with the 350... Mainly because Crash's relentless fabricating superiority just tightened my pants a little...

One may ask, "Why ask now? Why the heck don't you hold off until the decision to swap is finalized, perhaps after your previously stated "year" is up?", to which I would answer: Why not? Wouldn't I be safer completely exhausting every resource, and gathering info from every possible person who knows anything? Maybe a torque spec. for bellhousing bolts? A long-lost part number from someone who already needed to find it? Any intelligence I can gather on this now would be absolutely wonderful, and would ultimately serve to assist my decision in the long run as to which motor to swap. Simply put, the more knowledge I have, the better I will know WHAT to expect and HOW to deal with it.

What I am looking for is Toyota 6-Cylinder power, and I want it to be semi-simple (ie. no EXTENSIVE body/firewall modification). I also have done myself the pleasure of narrowing it down to 3 engines. So now, as I see it, I have 3 choices:

5MGE - 2.8L 6Cyl from Supra, N/A, 1982

Pros: No extensive mods needed, only slight motor mount modification, power improvement over the 22RE(145-175 HP, depending on the year, and easily 200 HP-capable), less costly than others.

Cons: Front-located sump won't clear IFS, cooling and exhaust problems to work out.

6MGE - 3.0L 6Cyl from Japanese Supra, N/A, 1986

Pros: Same block as 5MGE, similar modification required, significant power increases over 22RE(190-200 HP as opposed to 105-115 HP

)

Cons: Problems similar to that of a 5MGE swap.

7MGE - 3.0L 6Cyl from Supra, N/A, 1986-1/2

Pros: Proven design, 22RE-esque reliability, significant power increase over 22RE(190-200 HP), readily modifiable for more power, all the way to 250-275 HP N/A power.

Cons: Larger block design necessitates engine compartment modification, achilles-heel head gasket (22RE achilles-heel is timing components), slight driveline mods needed.

I don't know much more at this point, but I want decent power, Toyota reliability, and I want it to be relatively simple. So I was thinking 5MGE is the way to go, but then why not go for the 7MGE? 200 HP seems pretty good to me, but I don't want to just rape my poor little truck to put it in there... But I think i'm gonna have to do that anyway.

Any input? Feel free to correct me or fill in a blank where required.

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Glenn · 07-08-2005, 06:10 PM

What transmission do you plan to run? If you have the stock 5 speed now, its life will be shortened behind a 200 hp engine.

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 06:13 PM

I've heard that the G52 can take a bit more than 200, but I might be misinformed.

What if I go with the 5MGE? Do you think it'll survive against the small increase in HP (170-ish)?

N_Aviles · 07-08-2005, 06:21 PM

You definetly should use a W-series tranny behind any of those sixes....An R-series would be ideal.

Really though..I'd swap in a nice 3RZFE....

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 06:24 PM

R-Series?? I don't know about this one.

But I did hear of the W56 being a common swap for the stock 5-Speed

N_Aviles · 07-08-2005, 06:26 PM

R series trannies came in Turbo trucks(22RTE), 3VZE and 5VZFE trucks. They are also found in Turbo Supra's(1986.5-1992 MA70 series).

Glenn · 07-08-2005, 06:36 PM

Yeah, an R series would be good. R150 or R151 I believe it is. I am not sure, but I think they come behind the 3.4 Tacoma's, which put out 190 hp.

Don't you already have a W56? That is what my '89 has.

LittleRedToyota · 07-08-2005, 09:12 PM

yeah, w56 is the stock 5-speed behind a 22RE.

fingerman, just out of curiousity, why did you rule out the 3.4 v6? they are awesome engines, imho. if my engine died, my short list would be:

1. a 3.4 (5VZFE)
2. another 22RE
3. a 2.7 (3RZFE--the new 4 cylinder...keep the simplicity of a 4 cylinder, but get much more power than the 22RE).

i'd prolly do number 1 unless i couldn't find one for a reasonable price...i'd prolly run my w56 behind it until it died (which i suspect would not be for a long time) and then replace it with an R series tranny.

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 09:17 PM

Hmm.. Well I just timelined it and I found that my truck has a W56

with a RF1A transfer case? Does that sound right?

Dammit I haven't even CONSIDERED researching trannies. I guess I better read up.

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LittleRedToyota

yeah, w56 is the stock 5-speed behind a 22RE.

fingerman, just out of curiousity, why did you rule out the 3.4 v6? they are awesome engines, imho. if my engine died, my short list would be:

1. a 3.4 (5VZFE)
2. another 22RE
3. a 2.7 (3RZFE--the new 4 cylinder...keep the simplicity of a 4 cylinder, but get much more power than the 22RE).

i'd prolly do number 1 unless i couldn't find one for a reasonable price...i'd prolly run my w56 behind it until it died (which i suspect would not be for a long time) and then replace it with an R series tranny.

RReeeaaally? A 3RZ swap never even crossed my mind. Has it been done? And about the 5VZ... I like that motor. I've driven it, and I love the pep (even in a big heavy 4wd '02 it was nice...), but the economy from what I've heard is anything but appealing.

LittleRedToyota · 07-08-2005, 09:22 PM

yep...that sounds right.

btw, your transfer case is absolutely bullet proof. you do not need to worry about replacing that no matter which engine you go with.

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 09:24 PM

But the 3RZ... Any info on that swap?

And btw, I am opting for the older 6Cyl's because it has been done, therefore I think it might be within my grasp a bit better than trying to break new ground with another swap.

LittleRedToyota · 07-08-2005, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FingerMan20

Has it been done?

yep. i remember reading at least two threads about it...not sure where ...either yotatech, 4x4wire, or pirate. don't remember if it was a big deal to do...the 2.7 comes with a w59 tranny, though, so it might even bolt right up to your w56...or it might not.

i have a buddy with a 3.4 tacoma...man, i really like that engine...if i could take that and his e-locker out of his tacoma and put it in my pickup...drewl...

don't think he'd go for that, though.

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LittleRedToyota

I have a buddy with a 3.4 tacoma...man, i really like that engine...if i could take that and his e-locker out of his tacoma and put it in my pickup...drewl...

don't think he'd go for that, though.

I know a way to get him to go for it (or at least not be able to stop you...

LittleRedToyota · 07-08-2005, 09:43 PM

hehe...btw, the 3.4 for a 22RE swap has been done...i think off-road solutions might even make a kit for it.

FingerMan20 · 07-08-2005, 10:02 PM

ORS does make a kit, but from what I've already read, it seems impossible. Plus it is for the 3VZ to 5VZ, so their kit does me no good...

Another thing I stumbled across is a "conversion kit" for the 5MGE. From what I have read it is a stroker kit, with other mods, and it boosts HP in the 5MGE from stock 160 to 200 or more. This is very interesting, because I could do this, with much less cost than the 3.4L swap, and try out the 160 HP, mileage wise, and then add power if I want too.

FingerMan20 · 07-09-2005, 10:43 PM

Anyone else hear about the 6M conversion kit for the 5M engine? I've heard it called a 2.9 kit, or something similar.

FingerMan20 · 07-10-2005, 09:45 AM

Anyone??

4Hummer · 07-11-2005, 06:58 AM

Been following this thread a bit myself.

Planning on swapping my engine when (Or IF) she dies. I'd like to know if anyone has any info on the 2.7 swap (From a 22RE) Has it been done ?

07-08-2005, 06:10 PM	#2 (permalink)
Glenn Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ELN Posts: 1,651	What transmission do you plan to run? If you have the stock 5 speed now, its life will be shortened behind a 200 hp engine. __________________ -Glenn-

07-08-2005, 06:13 PM	#3 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	I've heard that the G52 can take a bit more than 200, but I might be misinformed. What if I go with the 5MGE? Do you think it'll survive against the small increase in HP (170-ish)? __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money

07-08-2005, 06:21 PM	#4 (permalink)
N_Aviles Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 26	You definetly should use a W-series tranny behind any of those sixes....An R-series would be ideal. Really though..I'd swap in a nice 3RZFE.... __________________ Noel Aviles http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...lagerunner.jpg

07-08-2005, 06:24 PM	#5 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	R-Series?? I don't know about this one. But I did hear of the W56 being a common swap for the stock 5-Speed __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money

07-08-2005, 06:26 PM	#6 (permalink)
N_Aviles Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 26	R series trannies came in Turbo trucks(22RTE), 3VZE and 5VZFE trucks. They are also found in Turbo Supra's(1986.5-1992 MA70 series). __________________ Noel Aviles http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...lagerunner.jpg

07-08-2005, 06:36 PM	#7 (permalink)
Glenn Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ELN Posts: 1,651	Yeah, an R series would be good. R150 or R151 I believe it is. I am not sure, but I think they come behind the 3.4 Tacoma's, which put out 190 hp. Don't you already have a W56? That is what my '89 has. __________________ -Glenn-

07-08-2005, 09:12 PM	#8 (permalink)
LittleRedToyota Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 299	yeah, w56 is the stock 5-speed behind a 22RE. fingerman, just out of curiousity, why did you rule out the 3.4 v6? they are awesome engines, imho. if my engine died, my short list would be: 1. a 3.4 (5VZFE) 2. another 22RE 3. a 2.7 (3RZFE--the new 4 cylinder...keep the simplicity of a 4 cylinder, but get much more power than the 22RE). i'd prolly do number 1 unless i couldn't find one for a reasonable price...i'd prolly run my w56 behind it until it died (which i suspect would not be for a long time) and then replace it with an R series tranny. __________________ Stan Marshall 1994 4x4 22RE/w56 SWB pickup

07-08-2005, 09:17 PM	#9 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	Hmm.. Well I just timelined it and I found that my truck has a W56 with a RF1A transfer case? Does that sound right? Dammit I haven't even CONSIDERED researching trannies. I guess I better read up. __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money Last edited by FingerMan20; 07-08-2005 at 09:23 PM.

07-08-2005, 09:22 PM	#11 (permalink)
LittleRedToyota Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 299	yep...that sounds right. btw, your transfer case is absolutely bullet proof. you do not need to worry about replacing that no matter which engine you go with. __________________ Stan Marshall 1994 4x4 22RE/w56 SWB pickup

07-08-2005, 09:24 PM	#12 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	But the 3RZ... Any info on that swap? And btw, I am opting for the older 6Cyl's because it has been done, therefore I think it might be within my grasp a bit better than trying to break new ground with another swap. __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money Last edited by FingerMan20; 07-08-2005 at 09:26 PM.

07-08-2005, 09:43 PM	#15 (permalink)
LittleRedToyota Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 299	hehe...btw, the 3.4 for a 22RE swap has been done...i think off-road solutions might even make a kit for it. __________________ Stan Marshall 1994 4x4 22RE/w56 SWB pickup

07-08-2005, 10:02 PM	#16 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	ORS does make a kit, but from what I've already read, it seems impossible. Plus it is for the 3VZ to 5VZ, so their kit does me no good... Another thing I stumbled across is a "conversion kit" for the 5MGE. From what I have read it is a stroker kit, with other mods, and it boosts HP in the 5MGE from stock 160 to 200 or more. This is very interesting, because I could do this, with much less cost than the 3.4L swap, and try out the 160 HP, mileage wise, and then add power if I want too. __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money

07-09-2005, 10:43 PM	#17 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	Anyone else hear about the 6M conversion kit for the 5M engine? I've heard it called a 2.9 kit, or something similar. __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money

07-10-2005, 09:45 AM	#18 (permalink)
FingerMan20 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Colorado Posts: 298	Anyone?? __________________ 1998 Tacoma Standard Cab 4x4 -5 Speed -2.7L 3RZ-FE -80,000 Miles -custom ISR Mod -Purolator Fuel Filter -Royal Purple -Marlin Crawler Shift Stuff -Lots of Plans -No Money

07-11-2005, 06:58 AM	#19 (permalink)
4Hummer Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,975	Been following this thread a bit myself. Planning on swapping my engine when (Or IF) she dies. I'd like to know if anyone has any info on the 2.7 swap (From a 22RE) Has it been done ? __________________ Michael 1991 4Runner 22RE. CHOP www.obsessiveoffroadclub.com

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