A couple noob lift questions

stevenf · 04-23-2008, 08:57 PM

When adding (lets say...) 3" coils for the front and 3 " lifting blocks for the back, Do you need shocks or can you just run off the coils and leaf springs? If you do want shocks, How do you find them at the right length to compensate for the 3,4,5" lifts?
Also, What are these torsion keys I keep seeing on ebay that are marked at 3" lift kits? How do these work?

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nc994run · 04-23-2008, 09:08 PM

I'm guessing you're talking about a truck considering you mentioned leafs and lift blocks. It would help to have some specific info on the truck like year and some other basic stuff

AxleIke · 04-23-2008, 09:12 PM

If you have coils in the front, you have no use for torsion keys.

Blocks are the absolute worst possible way to lift a truck. They decrease performance and put extra strain on the leafs, as well as being very dangerous.

I've been witness to a lift block leaving a truck at a high rate of speed on the trail. Luckily, all it did was hit a tree. It could have hurt someone pretty badly.

To find shocks, you use one of two things: The search feature located at the top tool bar on this site, or google. Both will give you a plethora of information about lifts.

I am not a big fan of suspension lifts. Little to no offroad performance gain, increased strain on all parts, and no room for bigger tires.

If you want better performance, get a body/drivetrain lift, and put on big tires. Cost you a lot less too.

stevenf · 04-23-2008, 09:26 PM

I have a 97 GMC jimmy 4x4.
I was looking to upgrade the suspension and put a/t tires on it. It got me thinking about lifts.
If the person decided to do 3" coil springs in the front, and new leaf springs, or add-a-leaf in the back. Do you have to find the right length shocks to compensate for the lift? Do add-a-leafs last long?

n16ht5 · 04-23-2008, 10:15 PM

and I thought that there was no such thing as a dumb question....

stevenf · 04-23-2008, 10:33 PM

Just because you know the answer doesnt mean everyone does. Im new to the offroad scene. I just recently got my truck and I would like a suspension upgrade without paying $1,000.00 for a kit. So if you feel like answering....
Do you have to have longer shocks to compensate the lift? Do some of you go without shocks at all? Do add-a-leafs last long?

NicCantDecide · 04-23-2008, 10:49 PM

think about it, a suspension lift raises the frame higher off the ground. The shock goes from the frame to the bottom of the springs which are still at the same height off the ground.

Therefore: if frame height goes up and spring height doesn't...then your shock length must obviously increase to compensate.

And you can go without shocks, but expect a really springy ride.

kylextrisler · 04-23-2008, 10:52 PM

GMC huh? you know this is yotatech...as in TOYOTA tech
we're not big on Chevy, Dodge, Ford, GMC, Nissan, Honda, or anything else

AxleIke · 04-23-2008, 10:55 PM

Not running shocks will be pretty bad, and possibly dangerous. The truck will be unstable at speed with any kind of manuvering or bumps. As long as its smooth and straight, you'd be okay. When we lost a shock, just one, on our Scout II, I thought we were going to lose control when the truck hit a pothole.

In other words, you need to run shocks. You need longer shocks. They sell them, i think, for your application.

You will have to bear with us, as this is a Toyota board, so only a few people will have any idea how the suspension is set up on your rig.

I'm also notifying a mod so that this can be moved to off topic, since it is not toyota related.

Taro · 04-23-2008, 10:56 PM

Is this the S10 based vehicle?

I'm not sure but I think you have torsion bars in the front and not coils. So in that case torsion keys could work for some minor lift. Not up to speed on how they exactly work but I think they reposition where the torsion bar sits so you can have more lift without increasing the spring rate as much. Then stock shocks would be fine.

You need shocks. Sounds like you are considering not using shocks at all. Dont do it. Truck will bounce down the street like a pogo stick and very unstable and dangerous.

If you lift the rear with springs or blocks you will need longer shocks. Should be easy to find out what you need by looking at various online sources for suspension.

You should consider a body lift. Those vehicles don't have much clearance for tires and the body lift will give you the most room for bigger tires. Only problem I have with that is those GM 4x4's already have the frame sticking way out the bottom of the truck and the body lift will make it even worse.

Best of luck.

AxleIke · 04-23-2008, 10:57 PM

Oh, and again, DO NOT USE BLOCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

**Tofer** · 04-23-2008, 10:58 PM

I dont.........even........ know how........... to reply...

WOW! casting my vote to join the ranks of "Yotatech Best Of"

**DeathCougar** · 04-23-2008, 11:01 PM

Shocks? What the hell you need them things fer?

CC_yota · 04-23-2008, 11:01 PM

Yes, you NEED shocks, and to find what shocks will fit type "off-road shocks" into Google and pick a manufacturer and check they're information guide.

Or, measure the distance between the shock mounts at full compression and extension of the suspension. The difference between the 2 is your shock travel, then once again enter "off-road shocks" into Google and find a shock in that length that you like.

Cobra_R · 04-23-2008, 11:03 PM

I dont wanna sound like a douche...but if you have a gmc...why are you on yotatech? I'm sure their are forums dedicated to gmc trucks.

ocdropzone · 04-23-2008, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenf

I have a 97 GMC jimmy 4x4.

Might want to try a Chevy Forum for your questions like this one:
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=17

you might want to also consult this FAQ:
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=517960

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenf

Do you have to find the right length shocks to compensate for the lift?

Yes

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenf

Do add-a-leafs last long?

Sometimes if you get a quality kit

Taro · 04-24-2008, 10:22 AM

OMG, you are sending him to Pirate.

georgiayota · 04-24-2008, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taro

OMG, you are sending him to Pirate.

lol... they better get ready for the smart a$$ comments

**DeathCougar** · 04-24-2008, 10:35 AM

Whats wrong with Pirate? They are a kind, well informed group of individuals who will treat you right and never treat you second class just because you dont have a $25k rock buggy!

**Lysmachia** · 04-24-2008, 01:17 PM

While I appreciate the guy asking a general question... this IS a Toyota Forum... and by the looks of it this thread is headed for the Drama LLama Lounge.....

Now the Poster may very well have a Toyota too which IMHO would give him the right to ask this question BUT Stevenf, you should have clarified from the get go that your Questions was about a 97 GMC Jimmy and not about a Toyota.

Oh and I echo AxleIke's sentiment. Don;t use blocks. Even though I have some since I swapped out my rear coils to Chevy leafs and in order to get the truck level we had to use them.... A necessary evil!

04-23-2008, 09:08 PM	#2 (permalink)
nc994run Contributing Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: blacksburg,va for school chapel hill, nc for home Posts: 992	I'm guessing you're talking about a truck considering you mentioned leafs and lift blocks. It would help to have some specific info on the truck like year and some other basic stuff __________________ Rob 1999 4Runner Limited 4x4, retrofitted e-locker/ ARB front locker with 4.88 Precision Gears, Tundra/LC lift, 2" 4Crawler BL, Nitto Mud Grappler 35's on 16x8, Marlin sliders, TJM T-15, Warn M8000 w/ synthetic line, Mad Mike's custom rear Bumper, deckplate and ISR mods, Vortex Muffler, custom made tube doors pictures here I support Banned Neliconcept

04-23-2008, 09:12 PM	#3 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,890	If you have coils in the front, you have no use for torsion keys. Blocks are the absolute worst possible way to lift a truck. They decrease performance and put extra strain on the leafs, as well as being very dangerous. I've been witness to a lift block leaving a truck at a high rate of speed on the trail. Luckily, all it did was hit a tree. It could have hurt someone pretty badly. To find shocks, you use one of two things: The search feature located at the top tool bar on this site, or google. Both will give you a plethora of information about lifts. I am not a big fan of suspension lifts. Little to no offroad performance gain, increased strain on all parts, and no room for bigger tires. If you want better performance, get a body/drivetrain lift, and put on big tires. Cost you a lot less too. __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

04-23-2008, 10:15 PM	#5 (permalink)
n16ht5 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Bellevue, WA Posts: 257	and I thought that there was no such thing as a dumb question.... __________________ photos.chrisneibauer.com - Truck Photos chrisneibauer.com - My Photos Alpentalic

04-23-2008, 10:52 PM	#8 (permalink)
kylextrisler Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sacramento, Ca Posts: 182	GMC huh? you know this is yotatech...as in TOYOTA tech we're not big on Chevy, Dodge, Ford, GMC, Nissan, Honda, or anything else __________________ LcCoils, Bj Spacers, procomp es9k's, 33x12.50 xterrains sittin on 15x8 black rockcrawlers, 4crawler Panhard drop bracket

04-23-2008, 10:55 PM	#9 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,890	Not running shocks will be pretty bad, and possibly dangerous. The truck will be unstable at speed with any kind of manuvering or bumps. As long as its smooth and straight, you'd be okay. When we lost a shock, just one, on our Scout II, I thought we were going to lose control when the truck hit a pothole. In other words, you need to run shocks. You need longer shocks. They sell them, i think, for your application. You will have to bear with us, as this is a Toyota board, so only a few people will have any idea how the suspension is set up on your rig. I'm also notifying a mod so that this can be moved to off topic, since it is not toyota related. __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

04-23-2008, 09:26 PM	#4 (permalink)
stevenf Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 36	I have a 97 GMC jimmy 4x4. I was looking to upgrade the suspension and put a/t tires on it. It got me thinking about lifts. If the person decided to do 3" coil springs in the front, and new leaf springs, or add-a-leaf in the back. Do you have to find the right length shocks to compensate for the lift? Do add-a-leafs last long?

04-23-2008, 10:33 PM	#6 (permalink)
stevenf Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 36	Just because you know the answer doesnt mean everyone does. Im new to the offroad scene. I just recently got my truck and I would like a suspension upgrade without paying $1,000.00 for a kit. So if you feel like answering.... Do you have to have longer shocks to compensate the lift? Do some of you go without shocks at all? Do add-a-leafs last long?

04-23-2008, 10:49 PM	#7 (permalink)
NicCantDecide Registered User Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Tempe, AZ Posts: 330	think about it, a suspension lift raises the frame higher off the ground. The shock goes from the frame to the bottom of the springs which are still at the same height off the ground. Therefore: if frame height goes up and spring height doesn't...then your shock length must obviously increase to compensate. And you can go without shocks, but expect a really springy ride.

04-23-2008, 10:56 PM	#10 (permalink)
Taro Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 223	Is this the S10 based vehicle? I'm not sure but I think you have torsion bars in the front and not coils. So in that case torsion keys could work for some minor lift. Not up to speed on how they exactly work but I think they reposition where the torsion bar sits so you can have more lift without increasing the spring rate as much. Then stock shocks would be fine. You need shocks. Sounds like you are considering not using shocks at all. Dont do it. Truck will bounce down the street like a pogo stick and very unstable and dangerous. If you lift the rear with springs or blocks you will need longer shocks. Should be easy to find out what you need by looking at various online sources for suspension. You should consider a body lift. Those vehicles don't have much clearance for tires and the body lift will give you the most room for bigger tires. Only problem I have with that is those GM 4x4's already have the frame sticking way out the bottom of the truck and the body lift will make it even worse. Best of luck.

04-23-2008, 10:57 PM	#11 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,890	Oh, and again, DO NOT USE BLOCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

04-23-2008, 10:58 PM	#12 (permalink)
Tofer Super Moderator Staff Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Tacoma WA. Posts: 6,912	I dont.........even........ know how........... to reply... WOW! casting my vote to join the ranks of "Yotatech Best Of" __________________ 94 4runenr: all the good stuff....... 89 4runner: 3.0, Auto, 5.29 lockright f/r. 31x10.5 wildcountry ATs. 81 2wd pickup: 22R \| 5-sp \| long bed \|Civic SI seats \| LockRight \| Hella 500s pacific-crawlers.com For all your Trail-gear and HID lighting Solutions Needs check out yotaworks.com Online store coming soon :)

04-23-2008, 11:01 PM	#14 (permalink)
CC_yota Registered User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: ATX/ Waco Posts: 378	Yes, you NEED shocks, and to find what shocks will fit type "off-road shocks" into Google and pick a manufacturer and check they're information guide. Or, measure the distance between the shock mounts at full compression and extension of the suspension. The difference between the 2 is your shock travel, then once again enter "off-road shocks" into Google and find a shock in that length that you like. __________________ 95 4Runner- 3vze- A/T- 4.88's Currently LC Coils BJ Spacers SAW T-Bars 32x11.50 BFG A/T's 15x8 black Rockcrawlers Marlin Crawler rear bumper

04-23-2008, 11:03 PM	#15 (permalink)
Cobra_R Registered User Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 34	I dont wanna sound like a douche...but if you have a gmc...why are you on yotatech? I'm sure their are forums dedicated to gmc trucks. __________________ 2002 Taco ExCab- 5spd, 4wd, 3.4L Mods: Deckplate mod, ISR mod, more to come...

04-24-2008, 10:22 AM	#17 (permalink)
Taro Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 223	OMG, you are sending him to Pirate.

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