Problem with front driveshaft after SAS

YOTA666 · 08-18-2009, 08:19 PM

Hey guys, I was just wondering what you all did for a front driveshaft after you finished SAS'ing?
I took my stock one and clearanced the heck out of it/lengthened it, but for some reason the friggin thing shakes like hell when I put it in 4wd. I know the balancing is way off but would that make it shake at slow speeds?
The thing seems to smoothen right out if i speed up but when i start moving from a stop it vibrates like crazy or when its engine breaking/going slow...

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islandboyjt20 · 08-18-2009, 08:26 PM

is your joints in good shape?

4Crawler · 08-18-2009, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOTA666

Hey guys, I was just wondering what you all did for a front driveshaft after you finished SAS'ing?
I took my stock one and clearanced the heck out of it/lengthened it, but for some reason the friggin thing shakes like hell when I put it in 4wd. I know the balancing is way off but would that make it shake at slow speeds?
The thing seems to smoothen right out if i speed up but when i start moving from a stop it vibrates like crazy or when its engine breaking/going slow...

Unless you rotated the knuckles on the front axle, your pinion angle is way off the the CV shaft (should be at 0 degrees for smooth operation):
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...n-Measurements

YOTA666 · 08-18-2009, 11:26 PM

This is what i did. http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/cvmod/

The shaft turns smooth as silk by hand... Once the vehicle is moving its a whole different story though.

4Crawler · 08-19-2009, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOTA666

This is what i did. http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/cvmod/

The shaft turns smooth as silk by hand... Once the vehicle is moving its a whole different story though.

Read the page I posted a like to above. The u-joint on the bottom (pinion) end of the shaft will only run smooth if it is at 0 degrees operating angle. You need to do something like this to fix it:

http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/rotated_housing/

Or live with it and leave the hubs unlocked until you need 4WD.

ocdropzone · 08-19-2009, 07:52 AM

who did the the lengthening? Crappy job is gonna give you crappy vibration. Also if you took out too much material from one side. Long slip joint?
pics of shaft?

4crawler is usually dead on for this stuff...

YOTA666 · 08-19-2009, 02:11 PM

oh i thought the u joint on the bottom was fine, i thought it was all in my cv joint on top. Thanks for the link.

I did the lengthening myself, basically just cut it in half and got some tubing with with the same inner diameter as the outer diameter of the shaft, then welded er up lol...

ill try and get a pic of it for you guys asap.

YOTA666 · 08-19-2009, 02:27 PM

Wheelingnoob · 08-19-2009, 03:27 PM

Do you have a high pinion front? I have the same problem but I have a single joint on each end and a low pinion. you may want to add a long slip on there too you are going to have problems with it coming apart.

Plumbrbob · 08-19-2009, 03:41 PM

I made mine longer too keeping the stock slip its a bad idea make sure is doesnt almost fall out at full droop bet it will and if it gets binded up cause it "almost slips out" bad things will happen

it looks like the DS u joints are phased but check again that will make it do weird vibration type things

also chekc the double cadigan joint the center peice gets worn out and if it breaks in 4wd it will smack your tranny UH OH

I made mine out of reciever stock cant do any better than 15-20mph but it does not shake it is noisy though and I have unlimited slip also if I smack it on a rock my cheap duralast lifetime u-joints break. u-joints are an easy trail fix plus i get a new one for free when i get back into town.

Plumbrbob · 08-19-2009, 03:42 PM

oh yea i ditched the double dumb joint and used a single out of a rear ds its much better has more degreeage

Plumbrbob · 08-19-2009, 03:44 PM

it really kinda looks like your drive shaft is not phased to each other maybe a few splines off hard to tell for sure from your picture

YOTA666 · 08-19-2009, 05:40 PM

what does phased mean?

One thing i was thinking about doing is to find a rear driveshaft and cut it down to fit the front, then it would have regular U joints on both sides. Do you guys think that would work? Im just not sure if it will bolt up to the flanges...

Thanks for the input guys!

4Crawler · 08-19-2009, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOTA666

what does phased mean?

One thing i was thinking about doing is to find a rear driveshaft and cut it down to fit the front, then it would have regular U joints on both sides. Do you guys think that would work? Im just not sure if it will bolt up to the flanges...

Thanks for the input guys!

Phasing really only applies to a single-cardan shaft (i.e lining up the u-joints):
- http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri....shtml#Phasing

On a CV shaft, not important, although I still try and line up the u-joint bearings with the lower CV joint bearings.

Plumbrbob · 08-19-2009, 08:29 PM

yup thats it X2

I wrench better than type thanks 4crawler

hey did you check to see if you have crazy play between the u-joints onthat double dumb joint? I bet thats the vibro vermin givin ya greif

Wheelingnoob · 08-20-2009, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOTA666

One thing i was thinking about doing is to find a rear driveshaft and cut it down to fit the front, then it would have regular U joints on both sides. Do you guys think that would work? Im just not sure if it will bolt up to the flanges...

That's what I have/did, I put the double cardon on the rear and the single on the front. you will also have the swap the Tcase flanges at the same time or get a TG adapter flange.

I have the single cardon in the front of my 4runner with a 3" sas and 12" slip. I also have crazy vibrations when in 4WD. If I go over 20kms/hr it starts to smooth out a bit but still not very good. I'm going to try and hi-pinion next to try and reduce the angle I have on the front.

SLOWBOOST · 08-21-2009, 01:15 AM

i'd ditch the cv setup if i was you. your pinion really needs to be facing the t-case flange for it to work correctly. rear shaft will work, you'll have to redrill the flanges to bolt it up and figure out some slip.

i made a square shaft. under $50, no vibes, used rear u joints and re-drilled the flanges. works awesome even up to speed.

ocdropzone · 08-21-2009, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plumbrbob

if I smack it on a rock my cheap duralast lifetime u-joints break. u-joints are an easy trail fix plus i get a new one for free when i get back into town.

yep-u-joints acting like a fuse are cheaper and easier to fix than a R&P

OP-you definitely need some more slip travel than stock:
not mine but why you want to make sure your stuff works

probably won't happen to you but thought it was a cool picture

YOTA666 · 08-21-2009, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ocdropzone

yep-u-joints acting like a fuse are cheaper and easier to fix than a R&P

OP-you definitely need some more slip travel than stock:
not mine but why you want to make sure your stuff works

probably won't happen to you but thought it was a cool picture

That is some pretty gnarly carnage haha...
I think you guys are right about the phasing, it looks like it is about 1 tooth off, dunno if that will make a drifference but ill correct that and try it.

If not I guess im gonna build a square driveshaft. I might need to anyways to correct the slip joint problem. The long travel slip joint kit is like $300 up here lol, and i already gotta get one for the back either way...

Where did you guys get the ujoint setup to weld on the square stock for the square driveshaft? Did you just cut them off of old driveshafts?

Thanks!

SLOWBOOST · 08-21-2009, 03:04 PM

yes just use the old ones off a rear shaft. the stock slip yoke is the quick part to fit in the 2" square tube, the yoke for the 2.5" requires a little more work.

you can do some searching and find alot of links for it.

08-18-2009, 08:26 PM	#2 (permalink)
islandboyjt20 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: WAIKANE, HAWAII Posts: 35	is your joints in good shape? __________________ WAIKANE... I BULIT...

08-18-2009, 11:26 PM	#4 (permalink)
YOTA666 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Gods Country British Columbia Posts: 19	This is what i did. http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/tech/cvmod/ The shaft turns smooth as silk by hand... Once the vehicle is moving its a whole different story though. __________________ 88 4RUNNER- 3.slow, Centerforce clutch, 2 inch body lift, s10 lowering blocks converted to lift blocks, Trail Mart SAS, trussed/armoured, 36" TSL's, pro comp 15x10 steelies.

08-19-2009, 07:52 AM	#6 (permalink)
ocdropzone Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: PDX, OR Posts: 4,701	who did the the lengthening? Crappy job is gonna give you crappy vibration. Also if you took out too much material from one side. Long slip joint? pics of shaft? 4crawler is usually dead on for this stuff... __________________ ~Robb '81 Trekker The B4Runner Build TREKKER Forum Mini FAQ/Misc Ideas Thread TRY THESE SEARCH LINKS GOOGLE FOR TOYOTA WEBSITES LINK TO ONLINE FACTORY SERVICE MANUALS Drive a real 1st Gen Wheel Responsibly, Don't Screw It Up for Others

08-19-2009, 02:11 PM	#7 (permalink)
YOTA666 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Gods Country British Columbia Posts: 19	oh i thought the u joint on the bottom was fine, i thought it was all in my cv joint on top. Thanks for the link. I did the lengthening myself, basically just cut it in half and got some tubing with with the same inner diameter as the outer diameter of the shaft, then welded er up lol... ill try and get a pic of it for you guys asap. __________________ 88 4RUNNER- 3.slow, Centerforce clutch, 2 inch body lift, s10 lowering blocks converted to lift blocks, Trail Mart SAS, trussed/armoured, 36" TSL's, pro comp 15x10 steelies.

08-19-2009, 02:27 PM	#8 (permalink)
YOTA666 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Gods Country British Columbia Posts: 19	__________________ 88 4RUNNER- 3.slow, Centerforce clutch, 2 inch body lift, s10 lowering blocks converted to lift blocks, Trail Mart SAS, trussed/armoured, 36" TSL's, pro comp 15x10 steelies.

08-19-2009, 03:27 PM	#9 (permalink)
Wheelingnoob Registered User Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Surrey, BC Posts: 267	Do you have a high pinion front? I have the same problem but I have a single joint on each end and a low pinion. you may want to add a long slip on there too you are going to have problems with it coming apart. __________________ 93 2dr 4runner "overland build" www.overlandcanada.com 89 Supra Built 2jz swap,T67 DBB and a Vipec V88.

08-19-2009, 03:41 PM	#10 (permalink)
Plumbrbob Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Tacoma, Washington Posts: 925	I made mine longer too keeping the stock slip its a bad idea make sure is doesnt almost fall out at full droop bet it will and if it gets binded up cause it "almost slips out" bad things will happen it looks like the DS u joints are phased but check again that will make it do weird vibration type things also chekc the double cadigan joint the center peice gets worn out and if it breaks in 4wd it will smack your tranny UH OH I made mine out of reciever stock cant do any better than 15-20mph but it does not shake it is noisy though and I have unlimited slip also if I smack it on a rock my cheap duralast lifetime u-joints break. u-joints are an easy trail fix plus i get a new one for free when i get back into town. __________________ 79 YotA ThinG Mods: http://www.yotatech.com/blogs/plumbr...list-mods.html

08-19-2009, 03:42 PM	#11 (permalink)
Plumbrbob Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Tacoma, Washington Posts: 925	oh yea i ditched the double dumb joint and used a single out of a rear ds its much better has more degreeage __________________ 79 YotA ThinG Mods: http://www.yotatech.com/blogs/plumbr...list-mods.html

08-19-2009, 03:44 PM	#12 (permalink)
Plumbrbob Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Tacoma, Washington Posts: 925	it really kinda looks like your drive shaft is not phased to each other maybe a few splines off hard to tell for sure from your picture __________________ 79 YotA ThinG Mods: http://www.yotatech.com/blogs/plumbr...list-mods.html

08-19-2009, 05:40 PM	#13 (permalink)
YOTA666 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Gods Country British Columbia Posts: 19	what does phased mean? One thing i was thinking about doing is to find a rear driveshaft and cut it down to fit the front, then it would have regular U joints on both sides. Do you guys think that would work? Im just not sure if it will bolt up to the flanges... Thanks for the input guys! __________________ 88 4RUNNER- 3.slow, Centerforce clutch, 2 inch body lift, s10 lowering blocks converted to lift blocks, Trail Mart SAS, trussed/armoured, 36" TSL's, pro comp 15x10 steelies.

08-19-2009, 08:29 PM	#15 (permalink)
Plumbrbob Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Tacoma, Washington Posts: 925	yup thats it X2 I wrench better than type thanks 4crawler hey did you check to see if you have crazy play between the u-joints onthat double dumb joint? I bet thats the vibro vermin givin ya greif __________________ 79 YotA ThinG Mods: http://www.yotatech.com/blogs/plumbr...list-mods.html

08-21-2009, 01:15 AM	#17 (permalink)
SLOWBOOST Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: savannah and tampa, fl. Posts: 171	i'd ditch the cv setup if i was you. your pinion really needs to be facing the t-case flange for it to work correctly. rear shaft will work, you'll have to redrill the flanges to bolt it up and figure out some slip. i made a square shaft. under $50, no vibes, used rear u joints and re-drilled the flanges. works awesome even up to speed. __________________ 91 sr5 38s and sas, 5 spd swap...over 300K!

08-21-2009, 03:04 PM	#20 (permalink)
SLOWBOOST Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: savannah and tampa, fl. Posts: 171	yes just use the old ones off a rear shaft. the stock slip yoke is the quick part to fit in the 2" square tube, the yoke for the 2.5" requires a little more work. you can do some searching and find alot of links for it. __________________ 91 sr5 38s and sas, 5 spd swap...over 300K!

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