My SAS - Page 2

SMOD · 10-13-2009, 01:51 PM

oh and the welds on the creeper gusset kit.. should I redo those because they have bubbles in them?

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whokrz · 10-13-2009, 08:51 PM

Your welcome, happy to help.

If you are referring to this weld

If you have a die grinder I would fix it. If all you have is a angle grinder with a cut off wheel I wouldn't because I would worry about damaging the round end of the axle where the trunnion bearings go. The main purpose of it is to hold your shock on. It is best to fix it just don't destroy your axle housing.

As long as the shackle extenders can't move side to side it should be ok. Making a cross member to connect the two would strengthen it. You could also run triangle gussets to reinforce front to back so that it could double as a trailer hitch. Basically box it all in.

____________
\ 0 /
should make it a lot stronger. I would make the gusset 6 inches where it contacts the frame and the other side should be how far the tube hangs down. This way it will spread the force over 12 inches of the frame. You will need 4 of these gussets per side.

In my opinion ramping the truck to see if welds that hold your suspension on break is a bad idea. Most failures occur over a period of time as stress cracks develop. It should be over built to the point that the rest of the truck could fold up around it and it would still be intact. If these welds or components fail on the road it will result in complete loss of control and endanger your life and others.

SMOD · 10-15-2009, 09:05 AM

Hmm ok thanks for the info. Yeah I think I'm going to fix up all the welds that are still sketchy. lol. So I just have to take the time to do it. I want to paint a bunch of stuff anyway like the knuckles and knuckle arm and u bolts.. etc. I'm gunna black it all out.

And the shackle hanger up front why would I need 4 gussets per side now? I thought this would work \o/ and I'd only have to make two right. I'm going to try to draw it out and get it up in my profile pics. And more truck pics are on the way.

And my main concern is the safety of my truck because I don't want it to break on the road and cause a crash or anything like that.

SMOD · 10-15-2009, 09:07 AM

Oh PS: Yeah my buddy is letting me borrow his die grinder but my air compressor sucks even though it is a stand up tank with rollers. I will grind it with the die grinder though it will just take awhile.

Dare44 · 10-16-2009, 12:05 AM

I am the buddy that did the shackle hangers, and it is hard to get the penetration needed for that weld in the place it is at with a flux core welder not gas.... I did layer it and it did pentrat it does not look pretty but i fully trust it. The welds on that shock to axle mount were done with no gas and no flux so that is why they look like they do.... I did not do those welds. Man it has been a while since i have been on here but I now remember why i came here you guys are so much more helpful than pirate with threads like this.

runnerboyy · 10-16-2009, 08:22 AM

so just curious, but why did you not cut a hole in your frame and weld the tubes in the frame??

whokrz · 10-16-2009, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMOD

Hmm ok thanks for the info. Yeah I think I'm going to fix up all the welds that are still sketchy. lol. So I just have to take the time to do it. I want to paint a bunch of stuff anyway like the knuckles and knuckle arm and u bolts.. etc. I'm gunna black it all out.

And the shackle hanger up front why would I need 4 gussets per side now? I thought this would work \o/ and I'd only have to make two right. I'm going to try to draw it out and get it up in my profile pics. And more truck pics are on the way.

And my main concern is the safety of my truck because I don't want it to break on the road and cause a crash or anything like that.

On each side of the tube I would run 2 gussets and then a plate to cover them so that it looks like part of the frame. This will look better and spread the stress over a larger area of the frame. This would require 8 triangle gussets and 4 plates. Just one gusset on either side of the tube would probably be strong enough, but you can make it stronger and have a nicer look with not much more work.
You may want to cut the tubes off so that you can properly align them so the shackle angle is the same. The tubes should be the same distance from the hanger and the springs should be parallel. You can put a few good tack welds on it that are easy to cut if you need to and then put the weight of the truck on the axle to make sure every thing is where you want it. Then if it is good fully weld it.

whokrz · 10-16-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by runnerboyy

so just curious, but why did you not cut a hole in your frame and weld the tubes in the frame??

He wanted more lift.
I am assuming he knows that he can get more arch out of the leaf springs.....
SMOD how much suspension lift are you going for?

runnerboyy · 10-16-2009, 08:20 PM

ha. oh

Dare44 · 10-16-2009, 11:25 PM

I agree he should have run it thro the frame, he was just copying a truck that all they wanted was to clear 38 inch tires and he has told others that thro the frame was a bad idea cuz you get less lift

when less lift is better....

SMOD · 10-19-2009, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whokrz

He wanted more lift.
I am assuming he knows that he can get more arch out of the leaf springs.....
SMOD how much suspension lift are you going for?

I only put 37's on now because it will be my daily driver but I'm going to put bigger tires on after the 37's probably 38's and then way later on probably sum 39.5's or 40' or sumthin so I wanted the higher lift for the bigger tires later on.

So the front is approximately 10-11 inches of lift after the springs settle and the rear is probably around 7-8 inches of lift.

I'm going to get gas for my 230v mig and run hardwire (maybe some flux core because I still have a lot left). I can't do well with flux core alone at all really unless it is flat. So I'll fix all my welds and junk when I get that. It should be by this week I get the gas or maybe next week. lol.
My welder manual says I should use 100% CO2 because of the thickness I'm welding (the frame). But the guy at a welding place in town said I should use 75% Argon and 25% CO2. He told me that's what the fab shops use around here. What do I really need?

I think I'm going to keep the shackle hangers under the frame to clear the huge tires later on.. But I'm going to wait until my springs settle before I gusset them up.

I'm receiving a lot of good info on yotatech and I thank all you guys for helping.

PS: a weld cracked on the frame extension in the rear. I'm going to probably redo every weld on my truck when I get the gas.

whokrz · 10-19-2009, 09:41 PM

I would gusset it before you drive it on the street.
In my 220v Miller 175 I run 75argon/25co2. Argon leaves a little nicer looking weld and co2 is cheaper. For your application either will work fine. I normally run at 30lbs for the gas, which is considered on the high side.
I would run co2 but my gauges are made for argon and had a warning label not to run straight co2 threw them.

SMOD · 10-26-2009, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whokrz

I would gusset it before you drive it on the street.
In my 220v Miller 175 I run 75argon/25co2. Argon leaves a little nicer looking weld and co2 is cheaper. For your application either will work fine. I normally run at 30lbs for the gas, which is considered on the high side.
I would run co2 but my gauges are made for argon and had a warning label not to run straight co2 threw them.

I've been driving it just around town. Everything seems to be holding but I'm still gunna redo the welds.

Ok cool so I'll probably go with 75% Argon and 25% CO2. That reminds me too that I need to look at my gauge and see what it's for if it's like yours and says I shouldn't run str8 co2. lol

SMOD · 10-29-2009, 09:00 AM

So I've seen the Trail-Gear and Marlin IFS steering box reinforcements and I had a question...

I think the trail-gear one is better because it has the 1/4" plate but I've never used either so I can't say for sure..

I have the material to make this myself to save a lil $$ but I don't know the demensions. I know I can figure them out. I just want to know before hand so I get a better sense of everything.

Thanks

runnerboyy · 10-29-2009, 10:55 AM

Def. do it yourself.... what measurements do you need??

agusgus3 · 10-29-2009, 05:22 PM

Cardboard, Cardboard, Cardboard!!!

SMOD · 11-02-2009, 02:44 PM

Lol. Yeah I thought about it and I can just create a template with cardboard! I'm going to try that out and I'm gunna beef it up like crazy I don't want it to ever move again. Lol. Anyway I ordered the piece for my welder so that should be here soon and then I'm getting gas and its goin down. lol.

BLKNBLU · 11-02-2009, 05:03 PM

Another approach on that shackle hanger for the front.

We did something similar to mine in the rear. We made blocks to weld to the frame and then welded the shackle hangers to the block. Up front you could do something similar. Get some square or rectangular stock, cut to fit the tubes, weld the tubes inside the stock then weld the stock to the frame. It would give you a much larger surface area to weld and also spread the stress over a bigger area.

Pics

from this thread
http://www.yotatech.com/f66/blknblu-...72/index5.html

SMOD · 11-03-2009, 12:36 PM

That's nice. That looks really strong. lol

I'm going to beef up the shackle hangers for sure. Something along the lines of your truck, BLKNBLU.

It's just a matter of doing all this work now. lol. I'm in college and work and it's hard to find any time really at all to work on my truck. But I have a break coming up where I will do all the work I can on my runner.

10-13-2009, 08:51 PM	#27 (permalink)
whokrz Registered User Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Suisun City, California Posts: 346	Your welcome, happy to help. If you are referring to this weld If you have a die grinder I would fix it. If all you have is a angle grinder with a cut off wheel I wouldn't because I would worry about damaging the round end of the axle where the trunnion bearings go. The main purpose of it is to hold your shock on. It is best to fix it just don't destroy your axle housing. As long as the shackle extenders can't move side to side it should be ok. Making a cross member to connect the two would strengthen it. You could also run triangle gussets to reinforce front to back so that it could double as a trailer hitch. Basically box it all in. ____________ \ 0 / should make it a lot stronger. I would make the gusset 6 inches where it contacts the frame and the other side should be how far the tube hangs down. This way it will spread the force over 12 inches of the frame. You will need 4 of these gussets per side. In my opinion ramping the truck to see if welds that hold your suspension on break is a bad idea. Most failures occur over a period of time as stress cracks develop. It should be over built to the point that the rest of the truck could fold up around it and it would still be intact. If these welds or components fail on the road it will result in complete loss of control and endanger your life and others. __________________ 1990 4runner, 22re, R151, 4.7, 5.29s, E-locker front, Lock-Rite rear, 37" MTRs, 51" rears all around Trail Reviews http://www.gentryoffroad.com Toyota Factory Service Manuals http://ncttora.com/fsm/index.html

10-15-2009, 09:05 AM	#28 (permalink)
SMOD Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: CA Posts: 334	Hmm ok thanks for the info. Yeah I think I'm going to fix up all the welds that are still sketchy. lol. So I just have to take the time to do it. I want to paint a bunch of stuff anyway like the knuckles and knuckle arm and u bolts.. etc. I'm gunna black it all out. And the shackle hanger up front why would I need 4 gussets per side now? I thought this would work \o/ and I'd only have to make two right. I'm going to try to draw it out and get it up in my profile pics. And more truck pics are on the way. And my main concern is the safety of my truck because I don't want it to break on the road and cause a crash or anything like that. __________________ 92 Japan made 4Runner SR5 - SAS. Rear Chevy 63's. 6in. wider wheel base. 6 shooter knuckles and hysteer. 14in Bilsteins. Flowmaster. and more :) My photo album http://www.yotatech.com/album.php?u=42437

10-15-2009, 09:07 AM	#29 (permalink)
SMOD Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: CA Posts: 334	Oh PS: Yeah my buddy is letting me borrow his die grinder but my air compressor sucks even though it is a stand up tank with rollers. I will grind it with the die grinder though it will just take awhile. __________________ 92 Japan made 4Runner SR5 - SAS. Rear Chevy 63's. 6in. wider wheel base. 6 shooter knuckles and hysteer. 14in Bilsteins. Flowmaster. and more :) My photo album http://www.yotatech.com/album.php?u=42437

10-16-2009, 12:05 AM	#30 (permalink)
Dare44 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: grass valley, ca Posts: 910	I am the buddy that did the shackle hangers, and it is hard to get the penetration needed for that weld in the place it is at with a flux core welder not gas.... I did layer it and it did pentrat it does not look pretty but i fully trust it. The welds on that shock to axle mount were done with no gas and no flux so that is why they look like they do.... I did not do those welds. Man it has been a while since i have been on here but I now remember why i came here you guys are so much more helpful than pirate with threads like this. __________________ 1997 Toyota 4x4 SR5 4runner 3.4 auto Toytec 3 inch coil spring Lift Custom Front bumper Trail Gear Rock Sliders Modified Stock skid plates Maxxis Bighorn M/T's / Goodyear Wrangler TD's Amp Custom Rims Cobra CB, 5ft Firestik http://www.cardomain.com/ride/3008195 Near Future List Rear Bumper Lockers 1st Gen Roll Bar Winning the Lottery?

10-16-2009, 08:22 AM	#31 (permalink)
runnerboyy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: cookeville tn Posts: 64	so just curious, but why did you not cut a hole in your frame and weld the tubes in the frame?? __________________ 1987 runner, sas, built housing, rebuilt motor, swapped from auto to manual with dual cases and a twin stick, detroit rear, locked front, home brew front bumper w/ winch, sliders, tg dual crossmember skid plate, 4.88s, 35" km2s, and way too much lift!

10-16-2009, 08:20 PM	#34 (permalink)
runnerboyy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: cookeville tn Posts: 64	ha. oh __________________ 1987 runner, sas, built housing, rebuilt motor, swapped from auto to manual with dual cases and a twin stick, detroit rear, locked front, home brew front bumper w/ winch, sliders, tg dual crossmember skid plate, 4.88s, 35" km2s, and way too much lift!

10-16-2009, 11:25 PM	#35 (permalink)
Dare44 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: grass valley, ca Posts: 910	I agree he should have run it thro the frame, he was just copying a truck that all they wanted was to clear 38 inch tires and he has told others that thro the frame was a bad idea cuz you get less lift when less lift is better.... __________________ 1997 Toyota 4x4 SR5 4runner 3.4 auto Toytec 3 inch coil spring Lift Custom Front bumper Trail Gear Rock Sliders Modified Stock skid plates Maxxis Bighorn M/T's / Goodyear Wrangler TD's Amp Custom Rims Cobra CB, 5ft Firestik http://www.cardomain.com/ride/3008195 Near Future List Rear Bumper Lockers 1st Gen Roll Bar Winning the Lottery?

10-19-2009, 09:41 PM	#37 (permalink)
whokrz Registered User Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Suisun City, California Posts: 346	I would gusset it before you drive it on the street. In my 220v Miller 175 I run 75argon/25co2. Argon leaves a little nicer looking weld and co2 is cheaper. For your application either will work fine. I normally run at 30lbs for the gas, which is considered on the high side. I would run co2 but my gauges are made for argon and had a warning label not to run straight co2 threw them. __________________ 1990 4runner, 22re, R151, 4.7, 5.29s, E-locker front, Lock-Rite rear, 37" MTRs, 51" rears all around Trail Reviews http://www.gentryoffroad.com Toyota Factory Service Manuals http://ncttora.com/fsm/index.html

10-29-2009, 09:00 AM	#39 (permalink)
SMOD Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: CA Posts: 334	So I've seen the Trail-Gear and Marlin IFS steering box reinforcements and I had a question... I think the trail-gear one is better because it has the 1/4" plate but I've never used either so I can't say for sure.. I have the material to make this myself to save a lil $$ but I don't know the demensions. I know I can figure them out. I just want to know before hand so I get a better sense of everything. Thanks __________________ 92 Japan made 4Runner SR5 - SAS. Rear Chevy 63's. 6in. wider wheel base. 6 shooter knuckles and hysteer. 14in Bilsteins. Flowmaster. and more :) My photo album http://www.yotatech.com/album.php?u=42437

10-29-2009, 10:55 AM	#40 (permalink)
runnerboyy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: cookeville tn Posts: 64	Def. do it yourself.... what measurements do you need?? __________________ 1987 runner, sas, built housing, rebuilt motor, swapped from auto to manual with dual cases and a twin stick, detroit rear, locked front, home brew front bumper w/ winch, sliders, tg dual crossmember skid plate, 4.88s, 35" km2s, and way too much lift!

10-29-2009, 05:22 PM	#41 (permalink)
agusgus3 Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 134	Cardboard, Cardboard, Cardboard!!!

11-02-2009, 02:44 PM	#42 (permalink)
SMOD Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: CA Posts: 334	Lol. Yeah I thought about it and I can just create a template with cardboard! I'm going to try that out and I'm gunna beef it up like crazy I don't want it to ever move again. Lol. Anyway I ordered the piece for my welder so that should be here soon and then I'm getting gas and its goin down. lol. __________________ 92 Japan made 4Runner SR5 - SAS. Rear Chevy 63's. 6in. wider wheel base. 6 shooter knuckles and hysteer. 14in Bilsteins. Flowmaster. and more :) My photo album http://www.yotatech.com/album.php?u=42437

11-02-2009, 05:03 PM	#43 (permalink)
BLKNBLU Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Gilbert, Arizona Posts: 1,667	Another approach on that shackle hanger for the front. We did something similar to mine in the rear. We made blocks to weld to the frame and then welded the shackle hangers to the block. Up front you could do something similar. Get some square or rectangular stock, cut to fit the tubes, weld the tubes inside the stock then weld the stock to the frame. It would give you a much larger surface area to weld and also spread the stress over a bigger area. Pics from this thread http://www.yotatech.com/f66/blknblu-...72/index5.html __________________ 86 4Runner, custom Sonoran Steel rear bumper, 4Crawler 1" body lift, rock sliders from Richard Stubbs, rear Lockright, SAS w/ARB My build thread. http://www.yotatech.com/f66/blknblu-s-sac-155872/

11-03-2009, 12:36 PM	#44 (permalink)
SMOD Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: CA Posts: 334	That's nice. That looks really strong. lol I'm going to beef up the shackle hangers for sure. Something along the lines of your truck, BLKNBLU. It's just a matter of doing all this work now. lol. I'm in college and work and it's hard to find any time really at all to work on my truck. But I have a break coming up where I will do all the work I can on my runner. __________________ 92 Japan made 4Runner SR5 - SAS. Rear Chevy 63's. 6in. wider wheel base. 6 shooter knuckles and hysteer. 14in Bilsteins. Flowmaster. and more :) My photo album http://www.yotatech.com/album.php?u=42437 Last edited by SMOD; 11-03-2009 at 01:53 PM.

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