How to disable VSC/TRAC on 4th Gen?

yabedude · 01-08-2005, 10:54 AM

Has anyone managed to install a switch that will disable the Vehicle Stability Control (VSC) and/or Traction Control (TRAC)? When offroading in snow or muddy conditions, the system wants to apply the brakes (ABS) when the wheels begin to spin. Many times, I want to be able to spin and keep momentum to get out of the nasty condition rather than be forced to slow and stop in the middle of it. I'm hoping that there is a wiring bypass switch that can allow me to temporarily disable the feature(s) on demand.

aowRS · 01-08-2005, 11:21 AM

While not about the 4th Gen, please read this to see where we are with the same issue on the late model 3rd Gens.

Andreas

mypalthetortoise · 01-08-2005, 12:36 PM

I thought locking the center diff turned the VSC off?

yabedude · 01-08-2005, 12:44 PM

That's correct. The center diff locking button does turn off the VSC. However, TRAC is still enabled. TRAC will apply ABS when a wheel is spinning. The other thread http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=45793 is on the right track (no pun intended).

DealMaker · 01-08-2005, 01:19 PM

To add to the TRAC confusion, I saw a small muddy field parking lot today and decided to check it out. With my center diff open, the TRAC kicked in almost immediately as I went into the field. Then a bit later, I locked the center, and proceeded to spin the tires and slid around a bit, and shot mud everywhere. It didn't seem that the TRAC kicked in at all. I was in 4H the whole time. Perhaps the TRAC disengages in 4H but activates again in 4L when the center is locked??

FirstToy · 01-08-2005, 01:31 PM

4th gen has GEN II ATRAC. imo, it's a really nice setup, I like it alot. It's amazing what it can do.
I've had the same experience as RBLA w/ the CDLocked.

bulldog-yota · 01-08-2005, 02:28 PM

VSC is disabled when you lock the center diff. The reason you dont like VSC is that it throttles back when it senses a lot of wheelspin, thus killing momentum. (ask me I got stuck badly ona sand dune because of this). When you lock the center diff TRAC still works in both 4H and 4L, however once you rev beyond 3500RPM (or somewhere close) TRAC turns off to prevent damage to the driveline. Imagine full throttle at high RPM and it grabs a brake and sends all the power to the other wheel. TRAC only sense the wheelspeed difference between wheels on the same axle, so if both are spinning at the same speed it will be happy. That is the reason why guys can put lockers on it with no ill effect, VSC however will create problems with lockers as it senses a whole lot of variables and acts accordingly.

So for snow, mud, sand, etc lock the center diff and you will be fine. WHen you feel the TRAC kicking in it actually just helps to maintain your momentum.

FirstToy · 01-08-2005, 03:04 PM

hmm, really good description Andries! I must refer to it in the future.

yabedude · 01-08-2005, 06:05 PM

Today, I confirmed the claims that high RPMs will effectively disable TRAC. However, high RPM's on a slippery snowy road is not for me. 3500 RPM's is a lot in the V8 and would be extremely unsafe on a tight road with rocks, trees, and major cliffs within arms reach. Need to find a way to kill TRAC on demand.

DealMaker · 01-08-2005, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yabedude

... However, high RPM's on a slippery snowy road is not for me. 3500 RPM's is a lot in the V8 and would be extremely unsafe on a tight road with rocks, trees, and major cliffs within arms reach. Need to find a way to kill TRAC on demand.

for slippery snowy roads you may just want to use cable chains, like these that I just bought the other day..
http://www.scc-chain.com/Pages%20Tra...ucts/szlt.html
size ZT-741

FirstToy · 01-08-2005, 10:13 PM

yabedude,
I guess I'm having a hard time understanding why you want to disable trac when going slow... not doubting your driving abilities or anything but am a little confused.

I ran some icey trails up in Big Bear last year and the trac was very good for those situations. Wheelspin= loss of control. I want traction, thus control.

For higher speed stuff, like the dunes Andries mentioned, it is transparent with the CDL... you can leave the CDLocked for your entire trip offroad...

Not saying trac is perfect or anything but...? imo, seems pointless to try to disable it. Hope I'm not opening a can of worms but how is this going to help on the trail?

Yota-Reign · 01-09-2005, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yabedude

Today, I confirmed the claims that high RPMs will effectively disable TRAC. However, high RPM's on a slippery snowy road is not for me. 3500 RPM's is a lot in the V8 and would be extremely unsafe on a tight road with rocks, trees, and major cliffs within arms reach. Need to find a way to kill TRAC on demand.

Funny you mention high RPM's on a slippery snowy tight road w/major cliff w/in arms reach... I was on a nice single lane gravel road with a several hundred feet drop on one side a couple days ago... oh yeah, like you said with about a foot of snow. I had a couple miles of windy road to go before I got to the top of the mountain where there is a nice big area to turn around... Well not having anyone wheeling with me that day I decided I should stop since the elevation gain would probably bring on 6-12 more inches of snow before I got to the top. Single lane road=reverse for 1/2 mile. Well I slid over towards the mountain side into the ditch. OOPS! Much better than sliding the other way of course, that's why I was closer to the ditch than normal. Hmmm.. spun the wheels a little, not making much headway... got the front wheels at full lock towards the other side of the road... had to just step on it until I could feel the tires hook up and was able to get out without slingshotting across the road over the edge... I doubt that killing the TRAC would have helped me at all.

Sorry guys, I forgot my camera.

Lesson Learned: Don't go wheeling w/out someone to help you safely recover your vehicle, a winch on my vehicle would not have helped me that day.

yabedude · 01-09-2005, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FirstToy

yabedude,
I guess I'm having a hard time understanding why you want to disable trac when going slow... not doubting your driving abilities or anything but am a little confused.

I ran some icey trails up in Big Bear last year and the trac was very good for those situations. Wheelspin= loss of control. I want traction, thus control.

For higher speed stuff, like the dunes Andries mentioned, it is transparent with the CDL... you can leave the CDLocked for your entire trip offroad...

Not saying trac is perfect or anything but...? imo, seems pointless to try to disable it. Hope I'm not opening a can of worms but how is this going to help on the trail?

FirsToy: It's not a can of worms. My request is becoming more common. I agree that TRAC is good if you have momentum, but when you have no momentum and are trying to get momentum, there is little you can do. Maybe you've not been in a real sticky situation yet?

Find a nice slimy stretch of trail that has 2 ruts about 8-9" deep so that the belly of your rig is dragging. Make sure it just rained and that the trail is basically a cattle trail and caked with mud like the Indians used to make houses with.

You do not want TRAC to kick in. You want all 4 wheels spinning to get you through that crap. Step outside the cabin and you'll be sinking up to your ankles in the . Been there, done that.

Only yesterday did I find out that high RPM's would have helped, but there are trails where I don't want to be driving like a maniac. It's too risky in some environments.

No, I want to have a switch to disable TRAC on demand so that I can maintain a constant wheel spin and not have to be spinning my wheels at 50 miles per hour.

FirstToy · 01-09-2005, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yabedude

FirsToy: It's not a can of worms. My request is becoming more common. I agree that TRAC is good if you have momentum, but when you have no momentum and are trying to get momentum, there is little you can do. Maybe you've not been in a real sticky situation yet?

Find a nice slimy stretch of trail that has 2 ruts about 8-9" deep so that the belly of your rig is dragging. Make sure it just rained and that the trail is basically a cattle trail and caked with mud like the Indians used to make houses with.

You do not want TRAC to kick in. You want all 4 wheels spinning to get you through that crap. Step outside the cabin and you'll be sinking up to your ankles in the . Been there, done that.

Only yesterday did I find out that high RPM's would have helped, but there are trails where I don't want to be driving like a maniac. It's too risky in some environments.

No, I want to have a switch to disable TRAC on demand so that I can maintain a constant wheel spin and not have to be spinning my wheels at 50 miles per hour.

I've been in the muck... it hasn't been an issue for me. It seems like maybe you are not in 4Lo at the time? 3000rpms is not hard to reach in 4Lo at all...

I totally don't get it but I'll just leave it at that. - and not to criticize what you're doing at all- hope you find a fix for your dilemma.

mypalthetortoise · 01-09-2005, 03:27 PM

I don't get it either.

You can't have front & rear lockers, since they don't make em yet... Why would you want no TRAC, it's the only thing to keep you in control of the truck?

I mean, yeah, you're right, it would be nice to have an on/off switch, but if you're following what Ducky's doing in that other thread, it ain't going to be plug & play.

FirstToy · 01-09-2005, 04:00 PM

ARB makes a rear locker and front will be coming soon. Good Times (aka, Dialup boy) is running a ARB rr locker for a while.

mypalthetortoise · 01-09-2005, 04:36 PM

I'm aware Lance is running a rear locker, but he is a rare breed. For 99% of the 4th gen public, though, TRAC actually keeps the wheels spinning controllably (like a limited slip differential does).

I don't want to discourage anyone from trying to turn off traction control; it's just not necessary or beneficial... IMO.

Remember, also, if you disable VSC, TRAC and any of the other "safety" features if your truck, you're the one who is inevitably responsible in the event of a crash/ injury.

FirstToy · 01-09-2005, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mypalthetortoise

You can't have front & rear lockers, since they don't make em yet...

just clarifying your statement, that's all.

trac/vsc won't be affected by installing ff/rr lockers (trac wont activate while locked but unlocked you will still have trac/vsc)

01-08-2005, 10:54 AM	#1 (permalink)
yabedude Contributing Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Surrey, BC, Canada Posts: 297	How to disable VSC/TRAC on 4th Gen? Has anyone managed to install a switch that will disable the Vehicle Stability Control (VSC) and/or Traction Control (TRAC)? When offroading in snow or muddy conditions, the system wants to apply the brakes (ABS) when the wheels begin to spin. Many times, I want to be able to spin and keep momentum to get out of the nasty condition rather than be forced to slow and stop in the middle of it. I'm hoping that there is a wiring bypass switch that can allow me to temporarily disable the feature(s) on demand. __________________ --Chris 2003 4Runner 4x4 4664 cc This was the Sport model, but hardly any more :)

01-08-2005, 11:21 AM	#2 (permalink)
aowRS Contributing Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Ellicott City, MD Posts: 899	While not about the 4th Gen, please read this to see where we are with the same issue on the late model 3rd Gens. Andreas __________________ 2001 SR5 4Runner 4WD, Dorado Gold, 153,XXX miles 2007 Volvo XC 90 AWD V6, Silver 1995 Porsche 993, Polar Silver

01-08-2005, 12:44 PM	#4 (permalink)
yabedude Contributing Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Surrey, BC, Canada Posts: 297	That's correct. The center diff locking button does turn off the VSC. However, TRAC is still enabled. TRAC will apply ABS when a wheel is spinning. The other thread http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.php?t=45793 is on the right track (no pun intended). __________________ --Chris 2003 4Runner 4x4 4664 cc This was the Sport model, but hardly any more :)

01-08-2005, 01:19 PM	#5 (permalink)
DealMaker Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: coastal L.A. Posts: 999	To add to the TRAC confusion, I saw a small muddy field parking lot today and decided to check it out. With my center diff open, the TRAC kicked in almost immediately as I went into the field. Then a bit later, I locked the center, and proceeded to spin the tires and slid around a bit, and shot mud everywhere. It didn't seem that the TRAC kicked in at all. I was in 4H the whole time. Perhaps the TRAC disengages in 4H but activates again in 4L when the center is locked?? __________________ '04 4Runner 4X4 SE V8 BFG KO 265/70/17 - Donahoe Coilovers - Deaver rear springs - Bilstein 7100 shocks - Hanna Sliders - Shrockworks Front Bullbar

01-08-2005, 02:28 PM	#7 (permalink)
bulldog-yota Contributing Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Morgan Hill, CA Posts: 1,882	VSC is disabled when you lock the center diff. The reason you dont like VSC is that it throttles back when it senses a lot of wheelspin, thus killing momentum. (ask me I got stuck badly ona sand dune because of this). When you lock the center diff TRAC still works in both 4H and 4L, however once you rev beyond 3500RPM (or somewhere close) TRAC turns off to prevent damage to the driveline. Imagine full throttle at high RPM and it grabs a brake and sends all the power to the other wheel. TRAC only sense the wheelspeed difference between wheels on the same axle, so if both are spinning at the same speed it will be happy. That is the reason why guys can put lockers on it with no ill effect, VSC however will create problems with lockers as it senses a whole lot of variables and acts accordingly. So for snow, mud, sand, etc lock the center diff and you will be fine. WHen you feel the TRAC kicking in it actually just helps to maintain your momentum. __________________ ___________________ ***andries*** 03 Pavement Princess 05 Mall Queen

01-08-2005, 12:36 PM	#3 (permalink)
mypalthetortoise Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 21	I thought locking the center diff turned the VSC off?

01-08-2005, 06:05 PM	#9 (permalink)
yabedude Contributing Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Surrey, BC, Canada Posts: 297	Today, I confirmed the claims that high RPMs will effectively disable TRAC. However, high RPM's on a slippery snowy road is not for me. 3500 RPM's is a lot in the V8 and would be extremely unsafe on a tight road with rocks, trees, and major cliffs within arms reach. Need to find a way to kill TRAC on demand. __________________ --Chris 2003 4Runner 4x4 4664 cc This was the Sport model, but hardly any more :)

01-09-2005, 03:27 PM	#15 (permalink)
mypalthetortoise Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 21	I don't get it either. You can't have front & rear lockers, since they don't make em yet... Why would you want no TRAC, it's the only thing to keep you in control of the truck? I mean, yeah, you're right, it would be nice to have an on/off switch, but if you're following what Ducky's doing in that other thread, it ain't going to be plug & play.

01-09-2005, 04:36 PM	#17 (permalink)
mypalthetortoise Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Georgia Posts: 21	I'm aware Lance is running a rear locker, but he is a rare breed. For 99% of the 4th gen public, though, TRAC actually keeps the wheels spinning controllably (like a limited slip differential does). I don't want to discourage anyone from trying to turn off traction control; it's just not necessary or beneficial... IMO. Remember, also, if you disable VSC, TRAC and any of the other "safety" features if your truck, you're the one who is inevitably responsible in the event of a crash/ injury.

01-10-2005, 12:05 AM	#19 (permalink)
Good Times Contributing Member