So sad, my poor baby
10-02-2013, 11:07 AM
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So sad, my poor baby
So my truck was having some trouble, and I didn't have the time or funds to take care it. Dying at the stop light turned into an embarrassing lack of power (where I could barely get the truck moving). I finally got it into the shop so somebody could take a look at it and hopefully get it going again, and they found that there is no compression in cylinders 3 or 4. They think this is due to valve damage/issues and advised me that the cost of repair would be more than my truck is worth (not hard for a 20 year old truck). Needless to say, this was very depressing news.
I could easily dig in myself, if I had a garage in which to place my truck over the winter where I could work as time and family allowed. Unfortunately, I don't have a garage, or even a carport.
So, I am looking for advice. How do I best take care of my truck over the winter in New England? A tarp, tent, plastic wrap?
I could easily dig in myself, if I had a garage in which to place my truck over the winter where I could work as time and family allowed. Unfortunately, I don't have a garage, or even a carport.
So, I am looking for advice. How do I best take care of my truck over the winter in New England? A tarp, tent, plastic wrap?
Last edited by YotaCody; 10-02-2013 at 11:09 AM.
10-02-2013, 02:56 PM
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just set up a makeshift garage, you could buy pvc pipe and 45 degree elbows to make a frame then throw some tarps on it for a roof. then you could take it down if you move, or just look for a cheap carport.
im thinking of buying a new head for my 4runner since i think i bent some valves, 450$ for a new head and a weekend of my time should get it running on 4 cylinders again, hopefully its valves and not piston rings for me
im thinking of buying a new head for my 4runner since i think i bent some valves, 450$ for a new head and a weekend of my time should get it running on 4 cylinders again, hopefully its valves and not piston rings for me
10-02-2013, 03:59 PM
#5
Yeah you can tackle that. See my old thread in my sig, as long as that took me in sub-freezing temps I got it done! Also, once you do it you'll wonder what the big deal was... I could do all that work over again in a long weekend now.
10-02-2013, 05:54 PM
#7
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Repairing your vehicle isn't completely an expense, it's also an investment -- and not just an emotional one...
Right now, your vehicle is basically worth scrap/parts w/ its nonfunctioning engine. By repairing your truck, you're restoring its value to its market rate. So worst case scenario ($2.5 to $3k parts and labor), you're losing, having a real expense only $1k...
If looking at other vehicles, I personally would only look at what I can get for that "expense" value of $1k. Why? Buying used cars is like rolling dice, and who knows when the next one will implode or explode... And buying a car incurs sales taxes and registration fees you'd probably rather not pay -- yes, most repairs incur sales tax, but with the internet and trading w/ friends, you can sometimes save serious $ on both repairs and taxes here...
Your mechanic probably saw that you didn't take care of your vehicle, so figured you must be like most car owners and drive until kaput, replace it with a different one, and repeat -- with either used or new cars...
Cars generally, are always an expense. But it's an expense you can easily manage (and more easily digest big repair bills) w/ some perspective.
Buying a new car is a worst case scenario. You're penalized by taxes, depreciation, insurance, and (if not paying cash -- always buy vehicles w/ cash IMO) you also incur financing charges. In the first year of owning a new vehicle, it loses ~40% of its value. So on a $30k vehicle, you lose $12k. You lose at least 5% sales tax ($1500). You spend 2.5 to 3x the insurance for a $30k vehicle than a $10k one. And financing on new is usually less than 5% of balance per year, but used it can reach 10-15%... Year one, your cost/actual expense on a $30k vehicle is ~50% of that vehicles value, $15k... That sucks, and $ you're just throwing away (unless the experience of owning a new car is that important/worth that dollar amount to you -- the only way it's justifiable).
In 3 years, you lose 60% of its value for depreciation ($6k per year) -- and probably greater than 80% of its initial value when all costs are considered (so of your $30k new vehicle "investment," you have $6k of it that's left after 3 years if you sell your vehicle and subtract all your expenses)... If you also have $30k in the stock market, you can't keep pace with the rate you're losing money from new car expenses...
Newer used cars are definitely a better decision than brand new, especially if not wanting to do a lot of maintenance, but recognize that only by 8 years is the significant, silent financial killer known as depreciation done wreaking havoc to your net worth.
So don't buy a vehicle newer than 8 years if you want to minimize cost of ownership as it's only going to be an expense/major financial drag. After 8 years, you aren't losing $ to depreciation, and since it has nearly fully depreciated -- its replacement value and accordingly insurance is lower.
So from then on, all your maintenance costs are for and can be considered preserving the value of your vehicle (no engine swaps and lifts and 35" tires are not maintenance -- they're expenses that likely won't be recouped beyond the value of whatever components were stock). So in a sense, those maintenance expenses are investments (to maintain vehicle value) -- and worst case they're expenses, same as and no more than you'd incur with any other vehicle. But car ownership expenses are minimized and only dollars spent are dollars lost -- your not losing thousands each year just by having the vehicle in your driveway...
A new car payment is $500+ per month. Take one half of that and put it into a savings account per month. $250/month is $3k per year. Minus insurance, you're at $2500. That's enough money for an engine rebuild/new engine/tranny each year if you'd like or otherwise keeping your rig in tip top shape. Toyotas are reliable, and you could probably get by on $100/month repair budget for life, but it helps to have some cushion for your vehicle or other emergency repairs. In my house we maintain two nearly 20 year old vehicles on that $250/month (gas not included in maintenance expenses).
The difference between used and new cars is that with new you pay a much bigger bill and bite that bullet all at once (you may realize it by writing payment checks each month, but that psychological pain/major hurdle is only experienced once). With used cars, most folks typically realize that pain with each repair bill that likely wasn't budgeted for -- a lot more hurdles/pain. If putting repair money aside each month, that pain is reduced and it's a heck of a lot easier to spend the money needed to stay on top of maintenance -- maintenance that makes the large, unexpected repair bills less likely.
Obviously, I'm a fan of used cars -- and keeping my used cars well maintained. Unfortunately, cars are often status symbols, instead of tools. And that leads to folks making horrible financial decisions. Please feel free to come to your own conclusions, but I don't think fixing your truck is a lost cause or a bad decision, even if paying someone else to fix, -- from either a financial or personal investment perspective -- once you take a few steps back and look at the alternatives. IMO, the only financial option better than repairing your 8+ year old vehicle (again, assuming that other than most recent issue it's been kept in good repair) is selling it and not planning to get another... But if you can't afford the repair immediately, buy one of those $500 used disposable beaters and save some cash for a couple months until you can afford the repair(s) on the vehicle you want to keep. And get rid of that $500 beater for the same $500 you paid for it... But definitely add up the $ for all needed repairs and do the math. You may decide it makes more sense to start over with another similar pickup that was (at least on face value, remember rolling the dice) better maintained -- taking a couple steps back helps with figuring the next step with your current rig beyond just looking that what's in the checkbook, etc...
(And no, I'm not a professional mechanic or used car dealer. Just IMHO advice.)
Right now, your vehicle is basically worth scrap/parts w/ its nonfunctioning engine. By repairing your truck, you're restoring its value to its market rate. So worst case scenario ($2.5 to $3k parts and labor), you're losing, having a real expense only $1k...
If looking at other vehicles, I personally would only look at what I can get for that "expense" value of $1k. Why? Buying used cars is like rolling dice, and who knows when the next one will implode or explode... And buying a car incurs sales taxes and registration fees you'd probably rather not pay -- yes, most repairs incur sales tax, but with the internet and trading w/ friends, you can sometimes save serious $ on both repairs and taxes here...
Your mechanic probably saw that you didn't take care of your vehicle, so figured you must be like most car owners and drive until kaput, replace it with a different one, and repeat -- with either used or new cars...
Cars generally, are always an expense. But it's an expense you can easily manage (and more easily digest big repair bills) w/ some perspective.
Buying a new car is a worst case scenario. You're penalized by taxes, depreciation, insurance, and (if not paying cash -- always buy vehicles w/ cash IMO) you also incur financing charges. In the first year of owning a new vehicle, it loses ~40% of its value. So on a $30k vehicle, you lose $12k. You lose at least 5% sales tax ($1500). You spend 2.5 to 3x the insurance for a $30k vehicle than a $10k one. And financing on new is usually less than 5% of balance per year, but used it can reach 10-15%... Year one, your cost/actual expense on a $30k vehicle is ~50% of that vehicles value, $15k... That sucks, and $ you're just throwing away (unless the experience of owning a new car is that important/worth that dollar amount to you -- the only way it's justifiable).
In 3 years, you lose 60% of its value for depreciation ($6k per year) -- and probably greater than 80% of its initial value when all costs are considered (so of your $30k new vehicle "investment," you have $6k of it that's left after 3 years if you sell your vehicle and subtract all your expenses)... If you also have $30k in the stock market, you can't keep pace with the rate you're losing money from new car expenses...
Newer used cars are definitely a better decision than brand new, especially if not wanting to do a lot of maintenance, but recognize that only by 8 years is the significant, silent financial killer known as depreciation done wreaking havoc to your net worth.
So don't buy a vehicle newer than 8 years if you want to minimize cost of ownership as it's only going to be an expense/major financial drag. After 8 years, you aren't losing $ to depreciation, and since it has nearly fully depreciated -- its replacement value and accordingly insurance is lower.
So from then on, all your maintenance costs are for and can be considered preserving the value of your vehicle (no engine swaps and lifts and 35" tires are not maintenance -- they're expenses that likely won't be recouped beyond the value of whatever components were stock). So in a sense, those maintenance expenses are investments (to maintain vehicle value) -- and worst case they're expenses, same as and no more than you'd incur with any other vehicle. But car ownership expenses are minimized and only dollars spent are dollars lost -- your not losing thousands each year just by having the vehicle in your driveway...
A new car payment is $500+ per month. Take one half of that and put it into a savings account per month. $250/month is $3k per year. Minus insurance, you're at $2500. That's enough money for an engine rebuild/new engine/tranny each year if you'd like or otherwise keeping your rig in tip top shape. Toyotas are reliable, and you could probably get by on $100/month repair budget for life, but it helps to have some cushion for your vehicle or other emergency repairs. In my house we maintain two nearly 20 year old vehicles on that $250/month (gas not included in maintenance expenses).
The difference between used and new cars is that with new you pay a much bigger bill and bite that bullet all at once (you may realize it by writing payment checks each month, but that psychological pain/major hurdle is only experienced once). With used cars, most folks typically realize that pain with each repair bill that likely wasn't budgeted for -- a lot more hurdles/pain. If putting repair money aside each month, that pain is reduced and it's a heck of a lot easier to spend the money needed to stay on top of maintenance -- maintenance that makes the large, unexpected repair bills less likely.
Obviously, I'm a fan of used cars -- and keeping my used cars well maintained. Unfortunately, cars are often status symbols, instead of tools. And that leads to folks making horrible financial decisions. Please feel free to come to your own conclusions, but I don't think fixing your truck is a lost cause or a bad decision, even if paying someone else to fix, -- from either a financial or personal investment perspective -- once you take a few steps back and look at the alternatives. IMO, the only financial option better than repairing your 8+ year old vehicle (again, assuming that other than most recent issue it's been kept in good repair) is selling it and not planning to get another... But if you can't afford the repair immediately, buy one of those $500 used disposable beaters and save some cash for a couple months until you can afford the repair(s) on the vehicle you want to keep. And get rid of that $500 beater for the same $500 you paid for it... But definitely add up the $ for all needed repairs and do the math. You may decide it makes more sense to start over with another similar pickup that was (at least on face value, remember rolling the dice) better maintained -- taking a couple steps back helps with figuring the next step with your current rig beyond just looking that what's in the checkbook, etc...
(And no, I'm not a professional mechanic or used car dealer. Just IMHO advice.)
Last edited by RSR; 10-02-2013 at 06:28 PM.
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10-02-2013, 09:48 PM
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As a fellow Masshole I can say I have spent many a winter day freezing my rearend of laying in a snow-covered driveway to fix my truck. As far as rebuilding your engine, I'm sorry, I have little knowledge. Winter proofing your Yota? Maybe I can offer my 2 cents worth. I have driven mine through two winters and let it sit in a shed with a dirt floor for 2 more. DON'T STORE IT OUTSIDE!!! My inner fenders are now shot and covered with more fiberglass than I can care to admit I used. I oil undercoat my truck religiously. Before winter, after winter, etc.
Coat the entire frame in oil. An HPLV paint gun and air compressor is probably the cleanest way to do it. I prefer to take a pump sprayer like you might use to spray Round-Up along a fence line and completely douse the frame. Inside and out. Pull out all your drain plugs, fill up the rocker panels, get behind the plastic inner fenders as salt water likes to sit there and make a mess of your firewall. Oil behind the gas tank. Mine, along with many other trucks, rotted out there. I know a guy that has driven a Yota for at least 20 plus years through mass winters and there isn't a speck of rot on his frame. he oils his regularly, pressure washes it after the snow is gone, and then takes an air compressor and blasts all the built up sand and salt out from the inside of the frame.
Make sure your heater vents that blow onto the floor work to dry out your carpet, too. Patching holes in your floor is not fun. Take to the car wash regularly too to wash all the salt off.
If you are really ambitious, when the snow clears pull the bed off your truck and pressure wash the frame. Bang off all the scale/ rust and get some POR-15 marine clean and a can of POR-15 paint. Brushing it on sucks and it can make a mess, but you can paint right over rust with it and it is supposed to be the next best thing to powdercoating in terms of toughness. Topcoat it with some rubberized undercoating and keep oiling the frame. Hope it helps...
Coat the entire frame in oil. An HPLV paint gun and air compressor is probably the cleanest way to do it. I prefer to take a pump sprayer like you might use to spray Round-Up along a fence line and completely douse the frame. Inside and out. Pull out all your drain plugs, fill up the rocker panels, get behind the plastic inner fenders as salt water likes to sit there and make a mess of your firewall. Oil behind the gas tank. Mine, along with many other trucks, rotted out there. I know a guy that has driven a Yota for at least 20 plus years through mass winters and there isn't a speck of rot on his frame. he oils his regularly, pressure washes it after the snow is gone, and then takes an air compressor and blasts all the built up sand and salt out from the inside of the frame.
Make sure your heater vents that blow onto the floor work to dry out your carpet, too. Patching holes in your floor is not fun. Take to the car wash regularly too to wash all the salt off.
If you are really ambitious, when the snow clears pull the bed off your truck and pressure wash the frame. Bang off all the scale/ rust and get some POR-15 marine clean and a can of POR-15 paint. Brushing it on sucks and it can make a mess, but you can paint right over rust with it and it is supposed to be the next best thing to powdercoating in terms of toughness. Topcoat it with some rubberized undercoating and keep oiling the frame. Hope it helps...
10-07-2013, 09:52 PM
#10
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Clicking through Kiplinger's cheapest new cars to own, the cost due to depreciation is in excess of $7.5k over 5 years for all cars listed (most are closer to $10k -- and depreciation is roughly equal to the cost of fuel for all as well; and fuel and depreciation combined are roughly 2/3rds of the cost to own): http://www.kiplinger.com/slideshow/c...013/index.html
Point being, eliminating depreciation alone reduces your costs of ownership by at least 1/3rd, IF (and big if) you purposely choose one of the cheapest models to own...
Point being, eliminating depreciation alone reduces your costs of ownership by at least 1/3rd, IF (and big if) you purposely choose one of the cheapest models to own...
10-08-2013, 04:20 AM
#11
Registered User
I'm with RSR, I'm a fan of a well maintained used vehicle, as long as you have good bones. This site is full of perfect examples, spend some time in the 'post your pics' thread and see what people have done to keep their trucks running. You'll find one that is the way you want yours to be, check out the build threads and see what they've done to get it that way.
10-08-2013, 06:57 AM
#12
I love how the Toyota's owners are rallying to support a fellow owner.. I read some excellent stuff on this thread, good job everyone.
Quickly, I'll add my experience.
I love cars. I don't like to drive just 'an car'... I feel like my cars are my friends, I can say that I have an emotional connection with my cars. (yes, it's a one way I understand
) I do own an A4 Quattro that I purchased brand new, and all of the things everyone said about depreciation is true, a new car is a huge 'usage' of money (hey, im not saying waste!) I've been through snow storms, hail, massive rainstorms, long cross country drives, sandstorm ( ruined some of the paint... ouch! ) and just many many good experiences that wouldn't be the same unless I was in the car I love. And a couple years ago I sold my jeep grand cherokee, 1998.. again, I loved that car. Took great care of it until the day my mom totaled and I sold it for $900 .. Funny thing, it only had a value of MAYBE 1700 before the accident.. which isn't much at all, but as others have said here, it's not all you look at when you are deciding to hold on to an older car or not.
Now, I am a part of this wonderful community forum because I recently purchased a seemingly 'piece of junk' 4Runner. I've always had a soft spot for these suckers since my dad had an 89 Tacoma SR5 4x4 and we took that thing to the tops of the Sequoias. All of my friends and my parents keep reminding me tha tI am wasting my time and working to hard that I should have just gotten a newer car. But, they are wrong. I just pulled th engine out and took it to a nearby shop who is going to remanufacture it for me for $1500. I spent $1400 to buy the thing. You don't even have to spend that $1400 now to buy it, you can just spend the money to fix it. And, if you're not afraid, you CAN do the work yourself.
Basically, if you've skipped ot this paragraph and didn't read the middle part.. your costs to fix the Toyota are worth it. As long as it's a car you love to have.
I need to get back to work!
Quickly, I'll add my experience.
I love cars. I don't like to drive just 'an car'... I feel like my cars are my friends, I can say that I have an emotional connection with my cars. (yes, it's a one way I understand
) I do own an A4 Quattro that I purchased brand new, and all of the things everyone said about depreciation is true, a new car is a huge 'usage' of money (hey, im not saying waste!) I've been through snow storms, hail, massive rainstorms, long cross country drives, sandstorm ( ruined some of the paint... ouch! ) and just many many good experiences that wouldn't be the same unless I was in the car I love. And a couple years ago I sold my jeep grand cherokee, 1998.. again, I loved that car. Took great care of it until the day my mom totaled and I sold it for $900 .. Funny thing, it only had a value of MAYBE 1700 before the accident.. which isn't much at all, but as others have said here, it's not all you look at when you are deciding to hold on to an older car or not. Now, I am a part of this wonderful community forum because I recently purchased a seemingly 'piece of junk' 4Runner. I've always had a soft spot for these suckers since my dad had an 89 Tacoma SR5 4x4 and we took that thing to the tops of the Sequoias. All of my friends and my parents keep reminding me tha tI am wasting my time and working to hard that I should have just gotten a newer car. But, they are wrong. I just pulled th engine out and took it to a nearby shop who is going to remanufacture it for me for $1500. I spent $1400 to buy the thing. You don't even have to spend that $1400 now to buy it, you can just spend the money to fix it. And, if you're not afraid, you CAN do the work yourself.
Basically, if you've skipped ot this paragraph and didn't read the middle part.. your costs to fix the Toyota are worth it. As long as it's a car you love to have.
I need to get back to work!
10-08-2013, 07:11 AM
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The primary resistance I get at home comes from the wife. She doesn't think that vehicles with over 100k miles are reliable and completely dismiss my truck. To be fair, I've got 215k, so things happen. With a one year old, my wife would like two safe, working vehicles that fit carseats...a Hilux reg cab does not fit this category.
So, let me ask, how many vehicles do you have?
So, let me ask, how many vehicles do you have?
10-08-2013, 07:21 AM
#14
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The primary resistance I get at home comes from the wife. She doesn't think that vehicles with over 100k miles are reliable and completely dismiss my truck. To be fair, I've got 215k, so things happen. With a one year old, my wife would like two safe, working vehicles that fit carseats...a Hilux reg cab does not fit this category.
So, let me ask, how many vehicles do you have?
So, let me ask, how many vehicles do you have?
Earlier this year we were driving my wife's 2007 Corolla and a '90 4Runner ran a red and broadsided us at 50 MPH. Everyone was ok, thankfully. Our "safe" Corolla was a mess, half the engine compartment ripped off and was strewn accross the street. The 4Runner after hitting us, launched in the air and rolled, travelling another 100 feet or so. All 4 people inside walked away with no injuries.
The 4Runner? The only damage was a messed up up fender and axle. The frame was completely intact.
I own two vehicles, my Pickup and a 2011 Nissan Altima Hybrid. Gotta have at least one car with good gas mileage.
10-08-2013, 07:35 AM
#15
The primary resistance I get at home comes from the wife. She doesn't think that vehicles with over 100k miles are reliable and completely dismiss my truck. To be fair, I've got 215k, so things happen. With a one year old, my wife would like two safe, working vehicles that fit carseats...a Hilux reg cab does not fit this category.
So, let me ask, how many vehicles do you have?
So, let me ask, how many vehicles do you have?
After tearing into it, I was VERY surprised the thing ever started. It even seems like the most complicated engine I've ever worked on with a million hoses everywhere, but it will get you home. I own two cars right now, my 2010 A4 (stick shift and quattro) and my 1991 4runner. Once the 4runner is complete, I'm going to let my wife take over the Audi because I need to get well acquainted with the 4Runner
10-08-2013, 07:37 AM
#16
Gamefreak, good to hear noone was injured in that accident. But remember, newer cars are engineered to tear apart in accidents to reduce the accelerations on the occupants. Makes sense for safety, does'nt work the same for reuseability. lol
