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I've never had any issues with Sankei "555" parts on any vehicle. They're my first choice for aftermarket parts if I'm not going with OEM Toyota. IIRC the ball joints still have zerk fittings like the other aftermarket brands, unlike Toyota which is a sealed unit that you can't service.
Another question, do you guys know anything about the quality of the 4crawler idler arm? Might as well upgrade to the bronze bushing while I'm at it and see that he sells them along with a new forged idler arm.
Doesn't matter how cleanly or how crudely you install BJ Spacers because either way its done they cause geometry issues. Take another look at the Wham Bam thank you Mam build thread.
Ok about to order the suspension kit tomorrow, hope they have it in stock.
Would you even recommend bj spacers in the first place? It seems that with the ome setup there would be some front end rake without the bj spacers.
OME kit includes beefier torsion bars right? So you should be able to adjust the front end ride height without a whole lot of pre-load to the adjusting bolt. Keep in mind the higher you set it the less down travel to be had. For example you should be working with around 8" travel with the stock set up (metal to metal). If you set the suspension to have 4 up and 4 down your lift may be minimal. If you set the lift +2" then your going to be 6 up and 2 down. When you increase ride height you sacrifice down travel. Adding BJ Spacers may allow more down travel but its not usable because the CVs, BJs, and outer Tie Rod Ends bind. To prevent these items from being damaged you then need to limit the down travel with droop stops or limit straps thus defeating the reason you installed the BJ Spacers in the first place.
Honestly the main reason I was leaning toward the bj spacers was to level out the front with the rear. Here are a couple of rigs from yt that run spacers and I think look killer imo
@Blazeland haha I'm listening to you man! Not disagreeing with you cause you know these IFS suspensions inside and out. I'm not going to get the bj spacers. After all you said and lots of reading, no doubt they cause some problems down the road. I'm just confused why people run them in the first place..guess its a cheap lift like torsion keys. Thanks again for your input.
Order update:
Ome kit from rocky road outfitters. They said it takes about 2 weeks to complete the order. Noticed they already charged my card even though it didn't ship yet. Think it's all good though.
Also placed my order from rock auto, all beck arnley parts. Upper/lower ball joints, inner/outer tie rod ends, and the adjusting sleeves.
Going to order the poly arm bushing next. Also figuring out what I want to do with the idler arm. Not sure if I want to buy the 4crawler one or just go to Napa auto. I read through that thread Blazeland and honestly don't know think I'll need a brace cause I don't wheel that much. Heck if I wanted a crawler I'd sas it! hahaha that's what they all say
The reason people run them in the first place is to fit larger tires than stock without cranking the t-bars and harshing the ride. Of course they're a solution for minor lift applications. They dont make a 3" bj spacer for good reason. So mainly they're an easy way to fit 33s.
Would there be anything to change for say an Expedition build on IFS? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the torsions bars will provide support for more weight right.
I'm glad your getting it! Sorry to seam short with you, its frustrating to me. As for why, that is a good question. I know from my customers who did it and then upgraded to LT they did it because the didn't really know much about it. However after installing them and dealing with the issues they had regrets. On the positive side it was a learning experience because the became more familiar with IFS components. In some ways it helped them prepare for going long travel. An education through baby steps.
Nippon, yes upgrading torsion bars from 22mm to say 25mm will provide support for more weight. They will also prevent hard bottoming the suspension. Thicker torsion bars = increase spring rate. With long arms the extra length = extra leverage so you need thicker T-bars to compensate.
If your just beefing up T-bars on stock length arms you are increasing the spring rate. This will provide support for more loads, it will prevent hard bottoming, it will require less pre-load to crank in the lift, and it will make the ride feel stiff. T-bars are a spring and the principles that apply to coils or leafs apply the same way.
Folks bag on Torsion bars all the time but if you have two identical IFS rigs, one with t-bars and one with coils, and they are showing the same 12" wheel travel, using the same bump and droop stops, and the same dampening in the shocks they will perform quite similarly. That is if your able to match the spring rate between the two systems. When using long arms I found a 22mm T-bar is like using a 300lb coil spring. Either spring will be too light. Bumping up to a 25mm T-bar is like bumping the coil to a 500lb spring. With T-bars one is limited as to spring choices where with coil springs they come in 50lb increments. There are many other technical aspects to the equation but tuning the suspension takes trial and error to the specific vehicle, the driver preferences, and the type of terrain or use.
Alright so a little update: parts are staring to arrive. Still figuring out what I'm doing with the idler arm.
Also I was thinking about buying a new pitman arm too, but don't think I need one.
Hey again. Parts are here and ready to start the install next week!
Any ideas on the idler arm? I've read that the oriely or autozone idler arm with the brass bushing is a pretty good setup. Also found a beck arnley idler arm that fits for a pickup but not an 87 4runner which is a bummer.
hummm. if your dropping any serious cash i would very much say do the total chaos idler arm. its hands down the beefiest/best readily available unit as far as my research has shown. i think they are 350. Doing a suspension overhaul right now as well. I would look at your pitman arm. Does the grease cover look clean and top to bottom sealing? any visible play jerkin around on your various front end bits? If not I would leave it be. No reason to replace pit/idler for the reason 'i was in there anyways' since they are both pretty much the fastest easiest right in front of your face'iest parts to replace
Honestly i would probably leave your idler arm alone too unless its bent or slop is noticeable there as well. Reading old threads here it seemed the autozone one was around 15-20 bucks. for the price of that pitman arm/idler arm combo on amazon your most the way towards paying down a total chaos idler arm, and i dont see the sankei unit as being vastly superior than the cheapie 15-20 autozone. I havent heard of the pitman arms taking quite the abuse/fail stories as i have the idler arm. Not sure why on that.
But ya im in your place, but when i cleaned up all the parts my heavily rusted idler arm's joint was still tight, the boot looked new. and meh, if i am going to replace that eye sore its going to be with a REAL upgrade that i can really beat on ya know wut im sayin?! the boot on my pitman arm looks haggard, but it looks like recent damage and there is no play yet. The stock pitman unit is a plain lookin part but its seems stout and ive put tons of miles on these front suspensions and the pitman arm design stands the test of time, unless going really extreme id prob just go stock or moog on it.
Again read up on what Blazen8 has posted regarding idler arms. I think it's in his idler brace thread. The affordable upgrade used to be an autozone part for like $50, it is beefier than the stock idler and when you add brass bushings and a brace it's very strong - but a short time ago this part became unavailable. Not sure what the current recommended upgrade is but I'd look at his thread because I think he posted what's currently available.
The Total Chaos idler is pretty much the strongest you can buy off the shelf of any manufacturers. I want to say it's based off a spindle for a tire swing out, way beefier than stock. It's around $400 and you'll never have to replace it likely. At the price of that idler you linked I'd personally just spend more on the TC.
A few people here on YT have examples of home built idlers too that look pretty beefy too.
not exactly sure how far your digging into your front end, but the sway bar bushings where included in a full poly kit i ordered. energy called it the hyperflex kit, included upper/lower control arms, sway bar (obviously), rear link and other odds and ends and it was about 150 bones. might save a pretty good chunk of cash if you havent already ordered other bushing bits separately that you are planning to replace
Thanks, I'll have to order those soon.
Alright so a little update.. Idler arm arrived last week and it was nice to see that 555 on it.
Last week was my spring break and I had planned to rebuild the suspension at Mudrak. Unfortunately, it was raining pretty much all week (I live in the northern part of the Bay Area) and Mudrak didn't have much room in the shop.
I'm a freshman in college and was planning to drive my 4runner up after school got out to my Uncle's house on Bainbridge island outside of Seattle to rebuild the suspension, he has a nice shop. While I didn't get around to rebuilding the suspension, I did pick up a 22re block crank and rods for $325! The block has been bored 30 over and the deck needs to be surfaced. The crank was micro polished and the rods are in good shape too.
So my new plan now is to focus on school for the last two months then go home and rebuild the suspension. I also need new tires as my bfg all terrains are from 2003... haha.
Planning on getting the new Ko2s and deciding if I should go with the 31x10.5x15s or the 32x11.5x15s. Anyways then I'll head up to my Uncle's place and rebuild the engine. Not a terribly exciting update but thought I'd share.
Well more than 9 months later I'm back. I finished up the suspension install this summer doing the rear one day and the front another. The front started at 9am and finished at 2am hah and included new shocks, upper and lower ball joints, inner/outer tie rod ends, ome steering stabilizer, ome torsion bars, poly bushings upper and lower arms, aisin manual hub swap, I think that's it. ha When we took down the skid plate we also noticed an oil leak. Thought it was coming from the distributor o ring and then found it was coming from the front main seal. Ended up that the bolt was loose...So I tore everything apart and noticed there was a non japanese seal. The original owner had the timing chain/tensioner and guides replaced and the shop apparently didn't use the best parts.. Anyways I put in a new radiator, upper and lower hoses, new coolant u shaped pipe, water pump gasket toyota of course, and front main seal toyota too. Switched back to green coolant too. Also got new 32x11.5x15 bfg ko2s. My only dilemma is that the truck rides like a solid axle. I'm back in school now and am not planning to do any work till May, but I wanted to ask you guys what you would recommend for shocks? I have done some research and it seems that the new ome nitro chargers are not great dd shocks and are more suited for a built and armored rig. In fact I removed the ome torsion bars and reinstalled the stock ones but the ride is still way harsh. My new plan is sell my nitro charger shocks and get new ones I'm thinking bilsetins. What size? My next plan is to reinstall the ome torsion bars. Lastly I'm planning to remove a leaf from the rear ome spring pack to lower the rear and soften it up more. I think it should be dialed then.
If you don't want to read all that, what shocks would you recommend?? And what size with ome torsion bars and rear leafs?
01-26-2016, 12:28 PM
