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86-95 Trucks & 4Runners 2nd/3rd gen pickups, and 1st/2nd gen 4Runners with IFS

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Old 05-28-2012, 07:13 AM   #1 (permalink)
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OBD1 software

Not sure if this is the right forum or not, but here is goes...

I got a 91 pickup, 2wd, auto, with a 22re. I was wondering if there is software for my laptop that does real-time monitoring. I've tried searching google and the only stuff I seem to find is OBD2 or GM software. Free would be better.

I'm asking because I don't feel like buying a bunch of gauges and having my dashboard covered with them. Plus I have an old netbook which I'm not using for anything productive at the moment. I'm okay with software that is for Windows or Linux.

Any help would be appreciated.
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Old 05-28-2012, 09:39 PM   #2 (permalink)
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No, Thats one of the big problems, OBD1 is as is, the only way to make any firmware adjustments is to get an aftermarket fuel management system.

You are lucky the 22re has a few companies that make them, the 3vze has nothing worth mentioning.
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Old 05-29-2012, 06:19 AM   #3 (permalink)
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If you say so...
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Old 05-30-2012, 07:34 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Sarcasm?

So where would you plug in a pc to make such changes, The only port is the diagnostic port under the hood and does not support serial comunications.
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Old 05-31-2012, 10:11 AM   #5 (permalink)
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The diagnostic port can be set up to download a slightly-nonstandard serial data stream. I once located a Russian website that had software (in Russian) that supposedly read the stream. So far as I can tell, it used bit-banging through a serial port, so that Netbook would do you no good. I never tried the software; the setup was a little sketchy. The site is gone now.

While I would be very, very interested in any device that could read the stream, I'm curious what gauges you think you could replace. You've already got tach and water temp. The interesting stuff (injector time, for instance) doesn't correspond to any gauge I've ever seen.
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Old 05-31-2012, 12:32 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Punchy View Post
Sarcasm?
Nope...well...maybe a little...

My point being that whatever you can do to modify OBDI, can be done just as easily on a 3VZ-E as it can on a 22R-E(or any other OBDI engine for that matter). Not to mention that doing EVERYTHING you can possibly do to modify/upgrade/enhance fuel management on a 22R-E(shy of nitrous) probably still wouldn't equal stock 3VZ-E performance. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it!

Furthermore, NOTHING can be done to reprogram the fuel management in a stock OBDI ECU(22R-E or 3VZ-E). Doing that requires adding hardware(piggyback or stand-alone ECU). Which costs quite a bit of $ any which way you do it. Without doing that all you can do is adjust/modify sensor voltage signals, tricking the ECU into running slightly richer/leaner than it otherwise would. But only so much can be done there, and it ain't a whole lot.

The most important thing to keep in mind here is that a stock OBDI ECU only has ROM(Read-Only Memory) and PROM(Programmable Read-Only Memory) for storage of programs, and a very small amount of RAM(Random Access Memory) used to store diagnostic codes. They DO NOT use EPROM(Erasable Programmable Read-Only Memory), or EEPROM(Electrically Erasable Programmable Read-Only Memory) for program storage. Meaning, once the programs are stored on the ROM and/or PROM chip(s) in the ECU(at the factory or elsewhere) they're READ-ONLY. And thus, THEY CANNOT BE MODIFIED/REPROGRAMMED.

If you want to change the OBDI software/programming, you have to swap out the ROM/PROM chip(s) in the ECU. Which also costs quite a bit of $. And also gets you only so much. Not very much for the amount of $ either, IMO.
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Old 05-31-2012, 03:11 PM   #7 (permalink)
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So it's not really much different than chipping an OBDI Ford, Nissan, Honda, or GM? Well, except that no one seems to have tried it and documented the process.

I might actually do some mods to my truck if I had a good way to tune it with OEM-sourced parts instead of hack-jobbing with VAM clock springs and AFPRs.
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Old 05-31-2012, 03:18 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirt Driver View Post
So it's not really much different than chipping an OBDI Ford, Nissan, Honda, or GM? Well, except that no one seems to have tried and documented it...
No, you flat out can't. I haven't heard of anyone chipping or reprogramming 80's Toyota ECUs unless they are from licensed after market manufactures, which never made anything for the Toyota Trucks or 4runners. Toyota was real secretive about the information on their ECUs so it is real hard to find any information on the ROM chips used in the ECUs.

Unless you are some electronics engineer specializing in automotive electronics or just some nerd that messes with
80's Toyota tech all day long, you won't be able to do anything.

Also you won't find any software that will read the OBD1 output from a Toyota in those years. OBD1 wasn't very standardized between manufactures so there is no CANBUS(which is used on OBD2 and up) to make it easy to output information.

Last edited by gennro; 05-31-2012 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 05-31-2012, 03:58 PM   #9 (permalink)
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No, you flat out can't.
Oh YES YOU FLAT OUT CAN...actually.
Click the image to open in full size.

Do your research...we've covered this before. That's achieved by sending them the stock ECU for them to remove the factory ROM and/or PROM chip(s) from the ECU MoBo, and then replace them with chips programmed to enhance performance. And YES, they'll do it to a 22R-E ECU for you too! See here for details.
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Old 05-31-2012, 04:07 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Jet performance doesn't make the best stuff. By the time you spend the money on that you can be running a standalone.

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Old 06-01-2012, 02:52 PM   #11 (permalink)
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MudHippy, I agree on all that.
Except Ive seen a aftermarket programmable ECU on a 22re and it did a great job, THe main reason is there is so many aftermarket parts for the 22re that make a substantual performance gain.
It was some time ago but I can remeber the whole head rework, Hightop pistons, Turbo (lbs unknown) and was all map sensor so no VAF, All in a 85 celica back in 2K.
Maybe not the torque of the 3vz but at least 25hp more and still better gas milage.
The guys was amazing how quick he could alter the MAP software from just watching a Air-fuel gauge, Now there are aftermarket that auto tune themseves.

Gennro, Have you dyno yours?
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Old 06-01-2012, 07:29 PM   #12 (permalink)
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A aftermatket ecu most likely wouldnt be a obd1 but a obd2 set up, thay was made to a plug and play to work with the factory harness
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:23 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I gotta laugh at 'hippy and everyone.

Toyota's VAST from what, 85-94 is not OBD I.
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:58 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by abecedarian View Post
Toyota's VAST from what, 85-94 is not OBD I.
It most certainly is.

Not that it matters, because all 85-95 EFI trucks & 4Runners use ESA instead of VAST.

Sounds like you need to read up on Toyota OBDI EFI/TCCS Ignition Systems* and Toyota OBDI and OBDII system definitions.

*The 22R-E(C) and 22R-TE do actually use ESA(as can be verified in the 85, 88, & 93 FSMs), not VAST as is stated in this pdf. Though both ESA and VAST were used in OBDI EFI/TCCS systems(just not those found in trucks & 4Runners).

And here's another quick tip: If you can't plug an OBDII scan tool into it...IT'S NOT OBDII!!!

Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

Who's laughing now?

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Old 06-03-2012, 11:03 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abecedarian View Post
Toyota's VAST from what, 85-94 is not OBD I.
What do you mean?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Punchy View Post
Except Ive seen a aftermarket programmable ECU on a 22re and it did a great job
That's why they're more popular than chipping a stock ECU, but we're not talking about aftermarket systems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by racerflea View Post
A aftermatket ecu most likely wouldnt be a obd1 but a obd2 set up, thay was made to a plug and play to work with the factory harness
They're not OBD compliant at all.
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Old 06-06-2012, 10:45 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MudHippy View Post
It most certainly is.
I'm not afraid to call you out- hyperlink us to the OBD-I standards on the SAE website.

Can't do that?
Wonder why?


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Old 06-06-2012, 12:29 PM   #17 (permalink)
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There is no OBD-I "standard," is there?
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Old 06-06-2012, 02:25 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Now you're being silly. When your Great-grandfather went off to war in 1917, was he fighting World War I? No, not until the late '30s was the Great War begrudgingly called WW-I.

Same with "On Board Diagnostics." California Air Resources Board required cars sold 1988 on have equipment that limited emissions. Because a failure of that equipment might not affect drivability, CARB required that the cars have On Board Diagnostics that would turn on a light if the equipment detected a fault. Other than that, there was very little standardization of how the fault was reported.

Eventually the Feds got on board, and a new standard for (about) 1995-on was (and is) referred to as OBD-II. OBD-II has a (partially) standardized way of reporting faults. At that point every prior On Board Diagnostic system got lumped together and called "OBD-I."

So if it's 1982 (lots of cars had OBD before it was required) to (about) 1994 and has a check-engine light or equivalent, it's "OBD-I."
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Old 06-06-2012, 02:55 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Yes, Toyota OBDI ecus CAN be chipped or reprogrammed. Maybe not by you. LOL. but shops do have this capability.
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Old 06-06-2012, 03:14 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Dear Abe and MudHippy,

You have both been previously banned, Mud you are one incident away from a permanent ban and Abe you were let back on after a perma ban after I convinced everyone to let you back. Ask them if you don't believe me.

Discuss, argue, rant all you want but either of you step out of line in this thread or anywhere else, it will be your last post on Yotatech.

You both have great technical knowledge to contribute, but do so without being a condescending smartass about it all the time.

Love,

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Old 06-06-2012, 03:14 PM
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