I'm now part of the 1st gen 4Runner owners club!
09-06-2009, 10:38 PM
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I'm now part of the 1st gen 4Runner owners club!
After six months of searching I finally bought a cheap 4Runner! Years ago I had an old 1980 Toyota 4x4 and I really missed the freedom that comes along with not worrying about scratches, dents, or resale value. It already has it's fair share of scratches and dents (though it's still pretty clean), so with this purchase I've regained that freedom.
It's a 1989 4Runner SR5 with the V6 engine and the 5speed manual, and I paid $1100 for it. I went back and forth constantly as to whether I should hold out for a 22re truck or go against my gut feeling and buy a V6. Thanks to many of you on here, the negative feelings I had about the 3vze have been suppressed (hopefully permanently). This has 153k, pretty low compared to the other ones I was looking at, and just had the timing belt and water pump replaced.
It does have it's fair share of problems, but for the price I paid I'm not complaining. The most pressing problem is a noise coming from the engine, and it could be quite serious. The guy I bought it from said it needed a valve adjustment, but it really sounds like it's coming from the bottom end. I had my dad, who's a mechanic, listen to the sound over the phone and he's thinking it's most likely a rod making the noise. It sounds like a constant hollow tick-tick-tick sound, and it does fluctuate with the engine RPM's. The thing is, it's intermittent, and mostly does it when it's cold. For the majority of the drive home it didn't do it no matter the RPM. Once I got home, turned it off, and started it up again after letting it sit for 10 minutes the sound was there but barely audible. There's no excessive smoke and there's still tons of power, but it does feel like there's a 'miss', especially at low RPMs, that shakes the whole vehicle. Any ideas?
Another thing that worried me is at idle the oil pressure gauge reads very low, just a bit above the bottom. When we rev it up, the pressure rises. I'm not sure if this is how it's supposed to be or if this is a problem. I have an oil pressure gauge I could hook up to get a true reading. If this is what I need to do, where's the best place to tap into the block and take a reading?
When I was going down the freeway tonight I cracked the driver side window and the top of it popped out about 2". I thought for sure it was going to fly out. What's the cause and fix for this?
I got home tonight and figured I'd see what it'd take to get the radio and rear window switch working, so I removed them and found close to the worse possible scenario. Of course someone cut the original stereo harness instead of spending the $20 for the plug and play solution, but apparently they didn't know what they were doing and gave up halfway through. I also noticed two harnesses were cut, one to the rear window switch and one to something else. Why someone would do this, I have no clue. Can any of you tell me what the other harness is for and the best way to repair the radio, switch, and other wiring? Maybe a wiring diagram for the stereo? Is the rear window supposed to be able to be rolled down with the lock on the tailgate? If so, I have to fix that too. Here are some pics of the mess:
Radio wiring:
What's this coming off the cigarette lighter?
Random red wire coming from the harness
Cut harnesses
Aside from those things, I need to replace the missing antenna, replace the dome light switch, recharge the AC (if it's not leaking), fix the loose driver side and rearview mirrors, and replace the latch for the center console.
All in all, for the price I paid, I think I have enough room to fix all this stuff and come out with a pretty nice rig.
It's a 1989 4Runner SR5 with the V6 engine and the 5speed manual, and I paid $1100 for it. I went back and forth constantly as to whether I should hold out for a 22re truck or go against my gut feeling and buy a V6. Thanks to many of you on here, the negative feelings I had about the 3vze have been suppressed (hopefully permanently). This has 153k, pretty low compared to the other ones I was looking at, and just had the timing belt and water pump replaced.
It does have it's fair share of problems, but for the price I paid I'm not complaining. The most pressing problem is a noise coming from the engine, and it could be quite serious. The guy I bought it from said it needed a valve adjustment, but it really sounds like it's coming from the bottom end. I had my dad, who's a mechanic, listen to the sound over the phone and he's thinking it's most likely a rod making the noise. It sounds like a constant hollow tick-tick-tick sound, and it does fluctuate with the engine RPM's. The thing is, it's intermittent, and mostly does it when it's cold. For the majority of the drive home it didn't do it no matter the RPM. Once I got home, turned it off, and started it up again after letting it sit for 10 minutes the sound was there but barely audible. There's no excessive smoke and there's still tons of power, but it does feel like there's a 'miss', especially at low RPMs, that shakes the whole vehicle. Any ideas?
Another thing that worried me is at idle the oil pressure gauge reads very low, just a bit above the bottom. When we rev it up, the pressure rises. I'm not sure if this is how it's supposed to be or if this is a problem. I have an oil pressure gauge I could hook up to get a true reading. If this is what I need to do, where's the best place to tap into the block and take a reading?
When I was going down the freeway tonight I cracked the driver side window and the top of it popped out about 2". I thought for sure it was going to fly out. What's the cause and fix for this?
I got home tonight and figured I'd see what it'd take to get the radio and rear window switch working, so I removed them and found close to the worse possible scenario. Of course someone cut the original stereo harness instead of spending the $20 for the plug and play solution, but apparently they didn't know what they were doing and gave up halfway through. I also noticed two harnesses were cut, one to the rear window switch and one to something else. Why someone would do this, I have no clue. Can any of you tell me what the other harness is for and the best way to repair the radio, switch, and other wiring? Maybe a wiring diagram for the stereo? Is the rear window supposed to be able to be rolled down with the lock on the tailgate? If so, I have to fix that too. Here are some pics of the mess:
Radio wiring:
What's this coming off the cigarette lighter?
Random red wire coming from the harness
Cut harnesses
Aside from those things, I need to replace the missing antenna, replace the dome light switch, recharge the AC (if it's not leaking), fix the loose driver side and rearview mirrors, and replace the latch for the center console.
All in all, for the price I paid, I think I have enough room to fix all this stuff and come out with a pretty nice rig.
09-07-2009, 01:36 AM
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You must've also bought a fire-proof vest if you are going to do this:
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=817879
Here's your stereo wires: http://www.the12volt.com/installbay/...tail/2020.html
If you want to, you can download the FSM here: http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/ and in there will be a circuit diagram.
Be ready for veiled abuse there. I'll look at my stuff and see what I can add later on this week if you haven't gotten any help yet.
http://pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=817879
Here's your stereo wires: http://www.the12volt.com/installbay/...tail/2020.html
If you want to, you can download the FSM here: http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/ and in there will be a circuit diagram.
Be ready for veiled abuse there. I'll look at my stuff and see what I can add later on this week if you haven't gotten any help yet.
Last edited by KelleyC; 09-07-2009 at 01:42 AM.
09-07-2009, 03:54 AM
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Thanks for the stereo link, just got the stereo working. It seems this thing has an alarm as well as a kill switch, but it's a real rats nest under the dash and my 12v skills are very limited. I was pretty proud of myself when that head unit lit up 
One thing I'm not sure about is both the constant and switched power are constant. I've seen people modify this before so you can listen to the stereo with the rig off, which is actually what I'd like it to do, but I want to make sure the stereo isn't draining power from the battery with the faceplate removed. Is there any way to test this and make sure?
As for the rear window switch, it looks like I'll have to try to find the harness connector from someone and extend it to get it working again. I'm still unsure what that other, larger bunch of wires is for.
Found out what that lead coming off the cigarette lighter is for as well, it's the light for the ashtray.
Regarding Pirate4x4, I know exactly what I'm getting into hahaha.
One thing I'm not sure about is both the constant and switched power are constant. I've seen people modify this before so you can listen to the stereo with the rig off, which is actually what I'd like it to do, but I want to make sure the stereo isn't draining power from the battery with the faceplate removed. Is there any way to test this and make sure?
As for the rear window switch, it looks like I'll have to try to find the harness connector from someone and extend it to get it working again. I'm still unsure what that other, larger bunch of wires is for.
Found out what that lead coming off the cigarette lighter is for as well, it's the light for the ashtray.
Regarding Pirate4x4, I know exactly what I'm getting into hahaha.
Last edited by Joey Link; 09-07-2009 at 04:12 AM.
09-07-2009, 04:49 AM
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That random red wire in that pic plugs into the center connector on the cigarette lighter.
So at least you will have one thing working if you plug that in.
I believe the first pic of the radio harness the red and yellow wire is battery constant power the red is igniton power for the radio and the blue and yellow wire is illumination.
Might be wrong but I know two of those are right at least the yellow wire and the red.
I have wired enough radios in my yota's.
Hope this helps some. Oh congrats on the 4 runner.
So at least you will have one thing working if you plug that in.
I believe the first pic of the radio harness the red and yellow wire is battery constant power the red is igniton power for the radio and the blue and yellow wire is illumination.
Might be wrong but I know two of those are right at least the yellow wire and the red.
I have wired enough radios in my yota's.
Hope this helps some. Oh congrats on the 4 runner.
Last edited by 934rnr; 09-07-2009 at 05:01 AM.
09-07-2009, 09:43 AM
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Congratulations on scoring a 1st gen runner.
Sounds like the oil pressure and knock could be related. I'd start with a thorough Seafoam treatment followed by a synthetic oil change.
Might keep her running until more serious work is needed.
Sounds like the oil pressure and knock could be related. I'd start with a thorough Seafoam treatment followed by a synthetic oil change.
Might keep her running until more serious work is needed.
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09-07-2009, 12:25 PM
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Today's To-Do List:
- Connect mechanical oil pressure gauge and read true pressure.
- Purchase mechanics stethoscope and try to determine whether the noise is coming from the top end or bottom end.
- Purchase blade connectors to complete stereo install.
- Wash exterior.
- Remove seats, vacuum interior, scrub carpets.
- Take pictures and post them here
- Connect mechanical oil pressure gauge and read true pressure.
- Purchase mechanics stethoscope and try to determine whether the noise is coming from the top end or bottom end.
- Purchase blade connectors to complete stereo install.
- Wash exterior.
- Remove seats, vacuum interior, scrub carpets.
- Take pictures and post them here
09-07-2009, 03:44 PM
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I had success on two fronts today. First, I re-wired the stereo and found the head unit not only works but sounds great with the aftermarket speakers: score one! Second, while reinstalling the stereo I remembered reading about the antenna up/down switch. I didn't put two and two together last night, but I just realized that's what I actually thought was the rear window up/down switch. I found the real rear window switch, took it apart, gave it a good cleaning, plugged it in, and the rear window now works perfect!
I still haven't been able to locate the oil pressure sender, so I'm hoping someone will chime in with that. My girlfriend is on detail duty and going over the whole thing with a toothbrush (literally).
Using the stethoscope it sounds like the sound is definitely coming from the bottom end
I'm really not sure what to do about it. Is there a way to fix it without pulling the engine? What're the odds it's going to be something relatively easy to fix? I'm looking to fix this on the cheap, so would it be best to drive it until it dies then buy a used 3.0 to swap in? Rebuilt 3.0's seem to be pretty spendy
I still haven't been able to locate the oil pressure sender, so I'm hoping someone will chime in with that. My girlfriend is on detail duty and going over the whole thing with a toothbrush (literally).
Using the stethoscope it sounds like the sound is definitely coming from the bottom end
I'm really not sure what to do about it. Is there a way to fix it without pulling the engine? What're the odds it's going to be something relatively easy to fix? I'm looking to fix this on the cheap, so would it be best to drive it until it dies then buy a used 3.0 to swap in? Rebuilt 3.0's seem to be pretty spendy
Last edited by Joey Link; 09-07-2009 at 03:48 PM.
09-07-2009, 06:50 PM
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Congrats on the rig, it looks just like mine, they could be twins!! Separated at birth. Mine is a 1989 SR5 V6 Auto, same baby blue paint and same faded rear top. I used to have the same SR5 rims. Pic of mine below.
First, on the oil pressure. The factory Toyota gages are notorious for reading low and they also vary greatly through the RPM range. I was concerned about mine in the beginning and hooked up a pressure gage to a high pressure port on the side of the block. The pressue was fine, just the sender/gage was the issue, so I left it alone. I'm not saying this is the case with yours and you should verify it with a separate gage, just to be sure.
Second, on the noise the motor is making. One thing you can try is to go to 20W50 oil to see if the noise is affected by oil viscosity. If the noise goes away, then you know it is bearing clearance related. If it is still there, you don't know anything more, it could still be bearing related. I would recommend an Auto-RX treatment for the next 3k miles. That stuff works, period. It might be a pressure issue with clogged oil flow passages. The SeaFoam or Auto-RX will address that.
The oil pressure sender is right in front and a little above the oil filter on the bottom driver's side front of the motor. Remove the skid plate from the front of the rig and you can see it up there, a little round, squat can with one wire going to it. You can easily remove it from below and hook up a mechanical gage, or access one of the high pressure ports down there on that side.
As for easy fixes of the above issue, if it is bottom end related, you are going to have the pull the motor. But, I have had many, many friends say they have rod knock and when they get it to my house, it is something else. I had a buddy convince himself the motor was knocking, it was the water pump. I would just say do not assume the worst right off the bat, start checking all the accessories and the easy stuff first.
Third, good job on the wiring, it seems like the PO or his mechanic was a bit of a hack. 12V wiring is really not that complicated, just a bit time consuming. Do you have a good multimeter? Having a good multimeter and knowing how to use it (instruction manuals are a lifeline) can save you a ton of time.
Pic of the twin:
First, on the oil pressure. The factory Toyota gages are notorious for reading low and they also vary greatly through the RPM range. I was concerned about mine in the beginning and hooked up a pressure gage to a high pressure port on the side of the block. The pressue was fine, just the sender/gage was the issue, so I left it alone. I'm not saying this is the case with yours and you should verify it with a separate gage, just to be sure.
Second, on the noise the motor is making. One thing you can try is to go to 20W50 oil to see if the noise is affected by oil viscosity. If the noise goes away, then you know it is bearing clearance related. If it is still there, you don't know anything more, it could still be bearing related. I would recommend an Auto-RX treatment for the next 3k miles. That stuff works, period. It might be a pressure issue with clogged oil flow passages. The SeaFoam or Auto-RX will address that.
The oil pressure sender is right in front and a little above the oil filter on the bottom driver's side front of the motor. Remove the skid plate from the front of the rig and you can see it up there, a little round, squat can with one wire going to it. You can easily remove it from below and hook up a mechanical gage, or access one of the high pressure ports down there on that side.
As for easy fixes of the above issue, if it is bottom end related, you are going to have the pull the motor. But, I have had many, many friends say they have rod knock and when they get it to my house, it is something else. I had a buddy convince himself the motor was knocking, it was the water pump. I would just say do not assume the worst right off the bat, start checking all the accessories and the easy stuff first.
Third, good job on the wiring, it seems like the PO or his mechanic was a bit of a hack. 12V wiring is really not that complicated, just a bit time consuming. Do you have a good multimeter? Having a good multimeter and knowing how to use it (instruction manuals are a lifeline) can save you a ton of time.
Pic of the twin:
09-08-2009, 09:45 AM
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Mike, thanks for that excellent post! It was very informative. You shouldn't have posted that pic, now my girlfriend is going to bug me about buying black rims for it even more than she does now! Clean truck 
Today I'm going to verify the oil pressure is good as well as change the oil and look for Auto-RX. Do you know of any chain stores that carry it? If it's used the same as Seafoam, which vacuum line should I use to put it into the engine?
Say it is bearing related but the Auto-RX or thicker oil make the sound go away, am I just buying time until I have the chance to pull the engine or can I consider the problem fixed? This motor looks like a real pain in the butt to remove! I'm pretty sure it's the bottom end cause when I put the stethoscope to the bottom end of the block, I can clearly hear the sound. I may need to try more places though, as I know it's possible for the sound to travel through components. That's just the loudest place I've heard so far.
Today I'm going to verify the oil pressure is good as well as change the oil and look for Auto-RX. Do you know of any chain stores that carry it? If it's used the same as Seafoam, which vacuum line should I use to put it into the engine?
Say it is bearing related but the Auto-RX or thicker oil make the sound go away, am I just buying time until I have the chance to pull the engine or can I consider the problem fixed? This motor looks like a real pain in the butt to remove! I'm pretty sure it's the bottom end cause when I put the stethoscope to the bottom end of the block, I can clearly hear the sound. I may need to try more places though, as I know it's possible for the sound to travel through components. That's just the loudest place I've heard so far.
Last edited by Joey Link; 09-08-2009 at 09:47 AM.
09-08-2009, 10:27 AM
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Mike, thanks for that excellent post! It was very informative. You shouldn't have posted that pic, now my girlfriend is going to bug me about buying black rims for it even more than she does now! Clean truck
Today I'm going to verify the oil pressure is good as well as change the oil and look for Auto-RX. Do you know of any chain stores that carry it? If it's used the same as Seafoam, which vacuum line should I use to put it into the engine?
Say it is bearing related but the Auto-RX or thicker oil make the sound go away, am I just buying time until I have the chance to pull the engine or can I consider the problem fixed? This motor looks like a real pain in the butt to remove! I'm pretty sure it's the bottom end cause when I put the stethoscope to the bottom end of the block, I can clearly hear the sound. I may need to try more places though, as I know it's possible for the sound to travel through components. That's just the loudest place I've heard so far.
Today I'm going to verify the oil pressure is good as well as change the oil and look for Auto-RX. Do you know of any chain stores that carry it? If it's used the same as Seafoam, which vacuum line should I use to put it into the engine?
Say it is bearing related but the Auto-RX or thicker oil make the sound go away, am I just buying time until I have the chance to pull the engine or can I consider the problem fixed? This motor looks like a real pain in the butt to remove! I'm pretty sure it's the bottom end cause when I put the stethoscope to the bottom end of the block, I can clearly hear the sound. I may need to try more places though, as I know it's possible for the sound to travel through components. That's just the loudest place I've heard so far.
As far as I know Auto-RX is only available through their website. It does not go into a vacuum line, you put it in the oil and run it for 3k miles. I have never used Seafoam, but have heard good things about it on here.
If you use Auto-RX or Seafoam and the noise goes away, then that indicates you had an oiling problem somewhere due to a clogged passage. There is damage to that area, but, if the knocking goes away that says that you are no longer touching down on that bearing and that the higher oil pressue is taking the load. I would run it like that until it comes back. It will not be fixed, the only way to do that is replace the the bearings.
You might also switch to 20W50 oil, as that will help take up the larger bearing clearances in the motor. The only caution on that is to be carefull in really cold weather and let it warm up before putting a heavy load on it.
I have seen guys pull a motor, put it on a stand, pull the bearings, measure the clearances, replace the bearings that are too loose, and bolt it all back together. If you have good compression in each cylinder, you can get away with the cheap fix for a while.
Where are you in Oregon?
09-08-2009, 11:22 AM
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Ah that's too bad about the weight. I told her we'll evaluate our options once this set of tires wears out. My whole goal for this thing is to keep the cost as low as possible so I can live frugally while paying off debt.
That's too bad I can't get it locally, I'd really like to do it today. Maybe I'll pick up a bottle of Seafoam and see if that helps. I'm definitely going to change the oil to 20W50 and see what that does.
I'm in Happy Valley, just east of Portland.
That's too bad I can't get it locally, I'd really like to do it today. Maybe I'll pick up a bottle of Seafoam and see if that helps. I'm definitely going to change the oil to 20W50 and see what that does.
I'm in Happy Valley, just east of Portland.
09-08-2009, 10:49 PM
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Well, today was a pretty good day. Ran seafoam through the intake, but I'm not sure if it helped because I didn't drive it afterward. I also put a third of the bottle in the oil, let it run for 15 minutes, then changed the oil to 20W50. Unfortunately that didn't help the sound at all. Lastly, I bought one of those $35 AC recharge kits, since I've always had good luck with them. Attached the r134a fittings, filled it with two cans, and I now have ice cold AC with no signs of leaks
If this sound doesn't end up being a rod knock I'm going to be one lucky guy for getting this thing for $1100!
By the way, for audio clips of the sound, go here: https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f116...-sound-191096/
If this sound doesn't end up being a rod knock I'm going to be one lucky guy for getting this thing for $1100!
By the way, for audio clips of the sound, go here: https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f116...-sound-191096/
