horrible metalic noise, code 5, loss of power
03-25-2009, 06:26 PM
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horrible metalic noise, code 5, loss of power
1986 22re, auto transmission.
truck was acting wierd for a few days, very under powered, and when it shifted, it would bog down real bad. I had to shift manuelly at 4k rpm to maintain speed.
The last time it did that, it just lost all power, and started making a loud metallic banging noise. and seemed to 'sputter'. drove it home the way it was very slowly (less than 3 miles), and by the time i got there it was overheating.
after a few days of trying to track down the sound, i got a code 5 error, bad 02 sensor.
under idle, it sounds fine.
Under any type of load, it tries to stall out. Absolutely no power, had to floor it with a 30 foot running start, to get it into my backyard. (3 inch curb)
anything over 2k rpm, and there is a really harsh metalic banging noise.
exhaust has black crud and moisture sputtering out, but its been doing that for a while now. but sounds normal. no backfiring or anything as far as I can tell.
visually inspected the flexplate through the access hole, looks fine. used a stethescope to check everything I could think of. Noise is definately coming from mid engine near rear.
Sound is loudest near the rear intake side, definately something metal banging.
I took off the valve cover and visually inspected it while the wife turned the key a few times. everything seemed to look normal.
Timing appeared off. sticker under the hood says it should be at 5 degrees, it was closer to 8. not sure if it was like that before this issue. set it to 5, same issue.
tried setting the timing from 0 to 12, still made the same noise.
Timing chain appears proper, no slag/breakage/etc..
Cam appears to be in good condition, no visible damage.
The metal banging noise is pretty bad.... I first thought the flex plate broke and that was what I was hearing.
No real noise at the oil pan or transmission, so im thinking its not a rod/bearing.
Tranny fluid looks fine, oil looks fine, coolant looks fine, so im assuming head gasket is in good condition.
No metal shreds, in fact... was kind of surprised how clean it was inside the head... oil passage is very good, when key turned, oil was sprayed EVERYWHERE.
Any ideas?
truck was acting wierd for a few days, very under powered, and when it shifted, it would bog down real bad. I had to shift manuelly at 4k rpm to maintain speed.
The last time it did that, it just lost all power, and started making a loud metallic banging noise. and seemed to 'sputter'. drove it home the way it was very slowly (less than 3 miles), and by the time i got there it was overheating.
after a few days of trying to track down the sound, i got a code 5 error, bad 02 sensor.
under idle, it sounds fine.
Under any type of load, it tries to stall out. Absolutely no power, had to floor it with a 30 foot running start, to get it into my backyard. (3 inch curb)
anything over 2k rpm, and there is a really harsh metalic banging noise.
exhaust has black crud and moisture sputtering out, but its been doing that for a while now. but sounds normal. no backfiring or anything as far as I can tell.
visually inspected the flexplate through the access hole, looks fine. used a stethescope to check everything I could think of. Noise is definately coming from mid engine near rear.
Sound is loudest near the rear intake side, definately something metal banging.
I took off the valve cover and visually inspected it while the wife turned the key a few times. everything seemed to look normal.
Timing appeared off. sticker under the hood says it should be at 5 degrees, it was closer to 8. not sure if it was like that before this issue. set it to 5, same issue.
tried setting the timing from 0 to 12, still made the same noise.
Timing chain appears proper, no slag/breakage/etc..
Cam appears to be in good condition, no visible damage.
The metal banging noise is pretty bad.... I first thought the flex plate broke and that was what I was hearing.
No real noise at the oil pan or transmission, so im thinking its not a rod/bearing.
Tranny fluid looks fine, oil looks fine, coolant looks fine, so im assuming head gasket is in good condition.
No metal shreds, in fact... was kind of surprised how clean it was inside the head... oil passage is very good, when key turned, oil was sprayed EVERYWHERE.
Any ideas?
Last edited by matrixxx1; 03-25-2009 at 06:38 PM.
03-25-2009, 06:38 PM
#2
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Do you have any way to check fuel pressure?
If it were a rod or beaing, you'd hear that at idle as well under load. Under load, you may be losing fuel pressure and getting engine knock. Not uncommon at all. Nor is it uncommon to get a code 5 (doesn't necessarily mean bad O2 sensor, just that the sensor is detecting a bad air/fuel mix in the exhaust) if you are losing fuel pressure to the combustion process.....running lean.
Check filter and pump.
If it were a rod or beaing, you'd hear that at idle as well under load. Under load, you may be losing fuel pressure and getting engine knock. Not uncommon at all. Nor is it uncommon to get a code 5 (doesn't necessarily mean bad O2 sensor, just that the sensor is detecting a bad air/fuel mix in the exhaust) if you are losing fuel pressure to the combustion process.....running lean.
Check filter and pump.
Last edited by thook; 03-25-2009 at 06:41 PM.
03-26-2009, 06:01 PM
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ok vaccuum test checked out.... seemed within spec, no wild flucuations.
Pulled the valve cover off again, had a friend look at it too.... both agreed... cam + lifters look like they are functioning perfectly.
Compression test:
1 - 150
2 - 150
3 - 135
4 - 150
after pouring in oil
1 - 150
2 - 150
3 - 150
4 - 150
So it looks like #3 is messed up.... Im assuming bad piston ring.... anything else it could be?
Forgot to check the fuel line pressure, and its already dark/cold out... DOH!.... tommorow...
Pulled the valve cover off again, had a friend look at it too.... both agreed... cam + lifters look like they are functioning perfectly.
Compression test:
1 - 150
2 - 150
3 - 135
4 - 150
after pouring in oil
1 - 150
2 - 150
3 - 150
4 - 150
So it looks like #3 is messed up.... Im assuming bad piston ring.... anything else it could be?
Forgot to check the fuel line pressure, and its already dark/cold out... DOH!.... tommorow...
Last edited by matrixxx1; 03-26-2009 at 07:07 PM.
03-26-2009, 07:17 PM
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o, before i did the tests I recorded a few vids...
Engine compartment:
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/MOV03683.mpg
Tailpipe with water/carbon:
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/MOV03684.mpg
At the rear of the engine, right above the egr plate
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/MOV03685.mpg
Pictures of Plug 4
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03686.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03687.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03688.jpg
Pictures of Plug #3
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03689.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03690.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03691.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03692.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03694.jpg
Pictures of the nasty mess than im gonna enjoy cleaning
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03695.jpg
Engine compartment:
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/MOV03683.mpg
Tailpipe with water/carbon:
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/MOV03684.mpg
At the rear of the engine, right above the egr plate
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/MOV03685.mpg
Pictures of Plug 4
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03686.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03687.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03688.jpg
Pictures of Plug #3
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03689.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03690.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03691.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03692.jpg
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03694.jpg
Pictures of the nasty mess than im gonna enjoy cleaning
http://www.matthewmontana.com/TRUCK/DSC03695.jpg
03-26-2009, 11:20 PM
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I'm going out on a limb here but I hear a 'tick' when at idle... however you're getting a 'knock' when the engine revs up. So i'm leaning at a connecting rod bearing.
If yours has the knock sensor, it could be retarding the timing causing a serious lack of power.
If yours has the knock sensor, it could be retarding the timing causing a serious lack of power.
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03-27-2009, 11:01 AM
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O sorry, I forgot to mention, NASTY exhaust leak on exhaust manifold, near #4 cyl.... I think thats the 'tick' at idle.
If the engine isn't fixable in my backyard... im thinking its time for a rebuild (at a shop) + new head + torkr cam from engnbldr
If the engine isn't fixable in my backyard... im thinking its time for a rebuild (at a shop) + new head + torkr cam from engnbldr
Last edited by mnmontana; 03-27-2009 at 12:19 PM.
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