High Altitude Adjustments?

Tdubbs05 · 02-05-2007, 03:00 PM

So I'm back in Flagstaff, AZ for college and there's definitely a noticable performance difference as expected, specially with a 3.slow. At 7,000 ft here, there's only 80% of the 02 there is at sea level. Now I know I can unplug the battery which will reset the computer, but is there any other adjustments I can make to make this thing perform better at this altitude?

...man this is when i had some a turbo going.

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Gnarly4X · 02-05-2007, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tdubbs05

So I'm back in Flagstaff, AZ for college and there's definitely a noticable performance difference as expected, specially with a 3.slow. At 7,000 ft here, there's only 80% of the 02 there is at sea level. Now I know I can unplug the battery which will reset the computer, but is there any other adjustments I can make to make this thing perform better at this altitude?

...man this is when i had some a turbo going.

You will drop about 4 numbers in torque and HP for every 1,000 feet climb in elevation from sea level... so take your HP and do the math.

There really isn't much you can do without serious modifications. Use 87 octane fuel and plan ahead.

gNARLS.

dcg9381 · 02-05-2007, 03:33 PM

Stuff more oxygen into your motor.. that's about it! As Gnarls says, that costs money.

Honestly, I dont know if unplugging the ECU does anything for you, at least not on the early 22REs (the 3.slow may be different). Unplugging assumes some learning capacity in the ECU and I believe the early EFI systems are simply reactive based on closed loop operation. Honestly, in closed loop you're probably operating at the same mixture you are at sea level.

I took a 5.4L V8 Ford into Colorado last month. At 8-9k feet, it'd hardly hold 70 miles per hour up an 8% incline. I can't imagine how that would have gone in a toyota.. I was looking, but didn't see any!

breknraj · 02-05-2007, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcg9381

I can't imagine how that would have gone in a toyota.. I was looking, but didn't see any!

You must not have been looking very hard! They're EVERYWHERE around here! j/k! lol!

ChickenLover · 02-05-2007, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tdubbs05

is there any other adjustments I can make to make this thing perform better at this altitude?

There is not a whole lot you can do. You might get a little help from the ISR mod and a drilled out airbox with a performance air filter... But not much.

slosurfer · 02-05-2007, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcg9381

I took a 5.4L V8 Ford into Colorado last month. At 8-9k feet, it'd hardly hold 70 miles per hour up an 8% incline. I can't imagine how that would have gone in a toyota.. I was looking, but didn't see any!

You probably thought they were bicycles if you were still doing 70. LOL

Tdubbs05 · 02-05-2007, 06:07 PM

that's what i was thinking...geez i'm really hurting then if you lose 4 all around for every 1000 ft. (120hp and 150 ft/lb...ouch) well i've drilled that airbox out and i've been wanting to do the isr mod.
thanks guys,

tc · 02-05-2007, 06:50 PM

That's why I want a turbo...

GV27 · 02-06-2007, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcg9381

I took a 5.4L V8 Ford into Colorado last month. At 8-9k feet, it'd hardly hold 70 miles per hour up an 8% incline. I can't imagine how that would have gone in a toyota.. I was looking, but didn't see any!

That must have been some sort of freak traveling Toyota-free vortex - Toyota trucks are pretty freakin' popular around here. A 3.slow 4Runner will hold 70 just about anywhere. You have to row the crap out of it but it will do it. Heaven help you if you have to check-up on a really steep section - you'll be over in the right lane with the semis!

Tdubbs05 · 02-06-2007, 08:17 AM

ah i think you're talking about my trip up here...lol well i've actually been pretty surprised at how well my 3.0's done up here. it is a huge pain in the a$$ have to put the pedal to the medal the whole way up, but if you keep her around the peak torque (which i believe is 3200 rpm) then you can keep your speed up pretty well.

RustBucket · 02-06-2007, 08:24 AM

Are you looking into regearing too? Lower gears = increase torque to the wheels. I see lockers are in your future too

mastacox · 02-06-2007, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcg9381

I took a 5.4L V8 Ford into Colorado last month. At 8-9k feet, it'd hardly hold 70 miles per hour up an 8% incline. I can't imagine how that would have gone in a toyota.. I was looking, but didn't see any!

I would have passed you no problemo. I don't call my new 4Runner the "wheezing yak" for nothing; it does great, even at 11,300 ft I was able to go any speed I desired!

That being said, without forced induction there isn't really anything you can do to tune an engine for altitude.

X-AWDriver · 02-06-2007, 09:03 AM

Even SC'd motors lose horspeower (and a couple psi of boost) accordingly since they still only have a certain amount of air to work with and they are dependant on the engine still. Turbos on the other hand can still hit max boost pressure but it'll take a little longer to hit it but it still will hit it.

NA and most SC'd motors still lose about a second (at our 5800ft dragstrip) while turbos won't lose as much.

My turboed Eclipse easily took down a Z06 Vette by about a half second (13.2 vs 13.6s) a few years back up here but down at sea level the Z06 would edge me out in the 1/4 due to the Z06 getting it's ponies back.

Most NAand SC'd street cars lose about a full second up here.

Even top fuel cars lose a couple of tenths at our altitude.

My truck is a little weak at 11000ft but it'll still pull highway speeds fine and off road it's not noticeable.

mastacox · 02-06-2007, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by X-AWDriver

Even SC'd motors lose horspeower (and a couple psi of boost) accordingly since they still only have a certain amount of air to work with and they are dependant on the engine still.

Amen to that. My oxygen sensor conditioner was not even kicking in half the time over 10,000 ft, because the critical pressure for it was set at 3 psi (3psi over sea level, so 17.7 psi absolute pressure). So even with my supercharger putting out about 6-7 gage psi, I wasn't able to get enough pressure in my engine.

When I get an EGT gauge, I'm going to need to try an even smaller pulley (2.1" maybe) and see where that gets me.

Atmospheric pressure's a finicky mistress.

Tdubbs05 · 02-06-2007, 09:53 AM

a trd sc would be nice...but it looks like turbos are the way to go these days. anyone turboing the new tacos/4runners?

i dunno about regearing yet cause it's still my dd and i need it to cruise back to CA. i try to keep it around 85-90 on the freeway and i think w/ lower gears i'd be sacrificing that.

mastacox · 02-06-2007, 09:56 AM

I don't think there are any Turbo kits for the 3.4 that are Cali SMOG certified.

Tdubbs05 · 02-06-2007, 10:03 AM

CA is so gay when it comes to emissions... luckily i past last month so i'm good for 2 yrs.

when it comes to toyotas and turbos...i wanna see toyota come midsize diesel. i think they'd own the truck market even more.

02-05-2007, 03:33 PM	#3 (permalink)
dcg9381 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: austin, tx Posts: 1,825	Stuff more oxygen into your motor.. that's about it! As Gnarls says, that costs money. Honestly, I dont know if unplugging the ECU does anything for you, at least not on the early 22REs (the 3.slow may be different). Unplugging assumes some learning capacity in the ECU and I believe the early EFI systems are simply reactive based on closed loop operation. Honestly, in closed loop you're probably operating at the same mixture you are at sea level. I took a 5.4L V8 Ford into Colorado last month. At 8-9k feet, it'd hardly hold 70 miles per hour up an 8% incline. I can't imagine how that would have gone in a toyota.. I was looking, but didn't see any! __________________ http://www.22REturbo.net

02-05-2007, 06:07 PM	#7 (permalink)
Tdubbs05 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Los Altos, CA (Flagstaff, AZ for college) Posts: 338	that's what i was thinking...geez i'm really hurting then if you lose 4 all around for every 1000 ft. (120hp and 150 ft/lb...ouch) well i've drilled that airbox out and i've been wanting to do the isr mod. thanks guys, __________________ Tim ___________________________________________ 1994 4Runner \| 3.slow Auto \| 265/75/16 Nitto Terra Grappler's \| Bilsteins \| Downey HD Kit \| ARB Bumper \| Warn M8000 \| 2 Lightforce 170's on the ARB \| Roof Rack w/ Checker HID's \|

02-05-2007, 06:50 PM	#8 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,372	That's why I want a turbo... __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-06-2007, 08:17 AM	#10 (permalink)
Tdubbs05 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Los Altos, CA (Flagstaff, AZ for college) Posts: 338	ah i think you're talking about my trip up here...lol well i've actually been pretty surprised at how well my 3.0's done up here. it is a huge pain in the a$$ have to put the pedal to the medal the whole way up, but if you keep her around the peak torque (which i believe is 3200 rpm) then you can keep your speed up pretty well. __________________ Tim ___________________________________________ 1994 4Runner \| 3.slow Auto \| 265/75/16 Nitto Terra Grappler's \| Bilsteins \| Downey HD Kit \| ARB Bumper \| Warn M8000 \| 2 Lightforce 170's on the ARB \| Roof Rack w/ Checker HID's \|

02-06-2007, 08:24 AM	#11 (permalink)
RustBucket Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Cumming, GA Posts: 977	Are you looking into regearing too? Lower gears = increase torque to the wheels. I see lockers are in your future too __________________ Rust-Free '88 Runner. Stay-at-home truck.

02-06-2007, 09:03 AM	#13 (permalink)
X-AWDriver Contributing Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Littleton,CO Posts: 10,174	Even SC'd motors lose horspeower (and a couple psi of boost) accordingly since they still only have a certain amount of air to work with and they are dependant on the engine still. Turbos on the other hand can still hit max boost pressure but it'll take a little longer to hit it but it still will hit it. NA and most SC'd motors still lose about a second (at our 5800ft dragstrip) while turbos won't lose as much. My turboed Eclipse easily took down a Z06 Vette by about a half second (13.2 vs 13.6s) a few years back up here but down at sea level the Z06 would edge me out in the 1/4 due to the Z06 getting it's ponies back. Most NAand SC'd street cars lose about a full second up here. Even top fuel cars lose a couple of tenths at our altitude. My truck is a little weak at 11000ft but it'll still pull highway speeds fine and off road it's not noticeable. __________________ '99 4Runner Highlander 4wd E-locker,rear diff and deckplate mod * 265/75/16 Nitto TerraGrapplers * Yakima Load Warrior rack * clear corners/signals * Tacoma skidplate * Silverstar lamps/fogs Alpine CDA-9831,Bazooka EL Series 250w amp,MTX 10" sub

02-06-2007, 09:53 AM	#15 (permalink)
Tdubbs05 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Los Altos, CA (Flagstaff, AZ for college) Posts: 338	a trd sc would be nice...but it looks like turbos are the way to go these days. anyone turboing the new tacos/4runners? i dunno about regearing yet cause it's still my dd and i need it to cruise back to CA. i try to keep it around 85-90 on the freeway and i think w/ lower gears i'd be sacrificing that. __________________ Tim ___________________________________________ 1994 4Runner \| 3.slow Auto \| 265/75/16 Nitto Terra Grappler's \| Bilsteins \| Downey HD Kit \| ARB Bumper \| Warn M8000 \| 2 Lightforce 170's on the ARB \| Roof Rack w/ Checker HID's \|

02-06-2007, 09:56 AM	#16 (permalink)
mastacox Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Los Alamos, NM Posts: 2,650	I don't think there are any Turbo kits for the 3.4 that are Cali SMOG certified. __________________ Brian 1998 4Runner SR5

02-06-2007, 10:03 AM	#17 (permalink)
Tdubbs05 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Los Altos, CA (Flagstaff, AZ for college) Posts: 338	CA is so gay when it comes to emissions... luckily i past last month so i'm good for 2 yrs. when it comes to toyotas and turbos...i wanna see toyota come midsize diesel. i think they'd own the truck market even more. __________________ Tim ___________________________________________ 1994 4Runner \| 3.slow Auto \| 265/75/16 Nitto Terra Grappler's \| Bilsteins \| Downey HD Kit \| ARB Bumper \| Warn M8000 \| 2 Lightforce 170's on the ARB \| Roof Rack w/ Checker HID's \| Last edited by Tdubbs05; 02-06-2007 at 10:04 AM.

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