EFI mystery to me...
01-20-2017, 10:39 AM
#82
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Thanks for the fresh eyes Charchee! I agree!
So far the most (only?) positive result was unsticking the EGR valve. EGR did begin moving yes
He confirms there isn't vacuum applied at idle via the E (EGR port) on the throttle body. And the temperature valve was working also. If thats what the test called for then yes. the tests mentioned have been done except O2, when the spec asked for heat range specs I used a heat gun and temp reader to check resistance check points.
So we/I didn't inquire how the modulator swap went. It was no change correct? This is correct. No Change.
I'm still concerned about that EGR valve it's self. Because of a weak or broken spring. It seems to open way to easy. Didn't you say you could blow it open? Was that manually applying (blow through) or shop air supplied? It was something like 4psi it was opening at, and you can "play it like a kazoo" wasn't it?
I was applying vacuum not pressure. 2.3 p.s.i. = 4.7 in/Hg vac. (if my gauge is in/Hg)
My gauge doesn't say Hg or psi but it's from the 60's or 70's so I'll guess Hg.
By opening and closing my hand around the hose adapter I could regulate flow.
The in house vac system tops out at about 7 in of vac as read on my engine vacuum tester (in the vid)
We haven't cracked open the exhaust system after the o2 sensor I think either to rule out a failing converter. Not really thinking it's the normal blockage problem, which would choke the engine out and get worse with higher flow/RPM, but more along the lines of enough back pressure in the exhaust to force the EGR valve open. I know on the RTE we see back pressure in excess of 20 psi inside of the exhaust manifold before the turbo and that valve doesn't/shouldn't get forced open. Is there a specific port to test for that vac? Also what is normal exhaust vac pressures for one of these?
Maybe do the soda can block off plate (smallish piece of aluminum wedged between the gasket and plenum). If nothing else that will atleast break my "tunnel vision" on that system.
Whats the test? I'll do it just get a little satisfaction that SOMETHING is better!
PS. How did those plugs look, have you changed those out already?
They looked fine but I put BKR5EYA's i
in this time. last set were BKR5EY's. A different socket eh?
So far the most (only?) positive result was unsticking the EGR valve. EGR did begin moving yes
He confirms there isn't vacuum applied at idle via the E (EGR port) on the throttle body. And the temperature valve was working also. If thats what the test called for then yes. the tests mentioned have been done except O2, when the spec asked for heat range specs I used a heat gun and temp reader to check resistance check points.
So we/I didn't inquire how the modulator swap went. It was no change correct? This is correct. No Change.
I'm still concerned about that EGR valve it's self. Because of a weak or broken spring. It seems to open way to easy. Didn't you say you could blow it open? Was that manually applying (blow through) or shop air supplied? It was something like 4psi it was opening at, and you can "play it like a kazoo" wasn't it?
I was applying vacuum not pressure. 2.3 p.s.i. = 4.7 in/Hg vac. (if my gauge is in/Hg)
My gauge doesn't say Hg or psi but it's from the 60's or 70's so I'll guess Hg.
By opening and closing my hand around the hose adapter I could regulate flow.
The in house vac system tops out at about 7 in of vac as read on my engine vacuum tester (in the vid)
We haven't cracked open the exhaust system after the o2 sensor I think either to rule out a failing converter. Not really thinking it's the normal blockage problem, which would choke the engine out and get worse with higher flow/RPM, but more along the lines of enough back pressure in the exhaust to force the EGR valve open. I know on the RTE we see back pressure in excess of 20 psi inside of the exhaust manifold before the turbo and that valve doesn't/shouldn't get forced open. Is there a specific port to test for that vac? Also what is normal exhaust vac pressures for one of these?
Maybe do the soda can block off plate (smallish piece of aluminum wedged between the gasket and plenum). If nothing else that will atleast break my "tunnel vision" on that system.
Whats the test? I'll do it just get a little satisfaction that SOMETHING is better!
PS. How did those plugs look, have you changed those out already?
They looked fine but I put BKR5EYA's i
in this time. last set were BKR5EY's. A different socket eh?
And remember it was COLD when this problem started but now its just normal temps 40-50s. All this work and testing has been in a 60+* garage. (that just sounds stupid when thinking about causes and effects still....)
01-20-2017, 11:00 AM
#84
Temporary EGR block plate
Google fails me, and I need to get out and put my power steering together...
Loosen the two bolts attaching the EGR at the rear of the intake, cut a slice from a soda can that fits between the two bolts and slide it under the gasket. Tighten the bolts back up.
Does the problem go away?
Loosen the two bolts attaching the EGR at the rear of the intake, cut a slice from a soda can that fits between the two bolts and slide it under the gasket. Tighten the bolts back up.
Does the problem go away?
Last edited by Co_94_PU; 01-20-2017 at 11:01 AM. Reason: Typo
01-20-2017, 02:22 PM
#86
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I get that he's referring to shutting off any vacuum to the EGR and will just cut a solid gasket for it. Its easier than drinking a can of soda...
01-20-2017, 02:48 PM
#87
Wally, I don't think he noticed and I failed to explain the details.
They are similar adjustments, in respect to the orrifce size at the choke point (adjustment screw). The idle air by pass passage in the air meter and the idle air by pass in the throttle body have similar mechanics, screw thread pitch, and opening areas.
I got lazy and didn't hunt down throttle body assembly specifications in a manual, I mean I looked but not really hard. I vaugely remember seeing it somewhere but could be thinking of a carburetor adjustment that I saw instead.
Could have ran mine in and counted the turns but I'm chasing a vacuum leak still (or ignoring one) and my screw is doped in fipg cause it's not original has no o-ring and kept wandering in and out.
(The comical back story that goes with that... My idle screw was AWOL from the PO, they had the idle screw port wrapped in a mountain of electrical tape, ew. When I hit the upull there were zero R series intakes so I grabbed an assortment. Think I wound up with a 3vz and a 1jz and not sure what the other one I pulled was, or exactly which ones made it home. I pulled three dropped them in my bucket but only found two were still there when I got home)
He just wanted a baseline since it's been fiddled with so much.
They are similar adjustments, in respect to the orrifce size at the choke point (adjustment screw). The idle air by pass passage in the air meter and the idle air by pass in the throttle body have similar mechanics, screw thread pitch, and opening areas.
I got lazy and didn't hunt down throttle body assembly specifications in a manual, I mean I looked but not really hard. I vaugely remember seeing it somewhere but could be thinking of a carburetor adjustment that I saw instead.
Could have ran mine in and counted the turns but I'm chasing a vacuum leak still (or ignoring one) and my screw is doped in fipg cause it's not original has no o-ring and kept wandering in and out.
(The comical back story that goes with that... My idle screw was AWOL from the PO, they had the idle screw port wrapped in a mountain of electrical tape, ew. When I hit the upull there were zero R series intakes so I grabbed an assortment. Think I wound up with a 3vz and a 1jz and not sure what the other one I pulled was, or exactly which ones made it home. I pulled three dropped them in my bucket but only found two were still there when I got home)
He just wanted a baseline since it's been fiddled with so much.
Last edited by Co_94_PU; 01-20-2017 at 02:52 PM.
01-20-2017, 03:03 PM
#89
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Google fails me, and I need to get out and put my power steering together...
Loosen the two bolts attaching the EGR at the rear of the intake, cut a slice from a soda can that fits between the two bolts and slide it under the gasket. Tighten the bolts back up.
Does the problem go away?
Loosen the two bolts attaching the EGR at the rear of the intake, cut a slice from a soda can that fits between the two bolts and slide it under the gasket. Tighten the bolts back up.
Does the problem go away?
I would say it surged mildly like it was 'looking for something' . but what do I know?
It didn't really respond to any idle screw adjustment but I forgot to re-set it when I fired it up.
It has that pronounce miss/ or miss fire.
It is running well enough to do some plug wire testing.
So what would you like to do on my truck next???
I can take it for a spin and report or shoot a video of it's next fire up. (maybe with plug testing!)
One or the other or somethunother?
01-20-2017, 03:09 PM
#90
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Beat you to it.
Re-set the idle screw fired it up, it searched and found a happyish spot, so I started pulling wires and #2 said "What you want change with that?"
Re-set the idle screw fired it up, it searched and found a happyish spot, so I started pulling wires and #2 said "What you want change with that?"
01-20-2017, 03:56 PM
#93
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I just knew you had a dead cylinder. Your description of the symptom was way too similar to the one I had when I was running on 3 of 6. That's probably going to be an injector. Since you are going to be down in there anyway, I would suggest changing all of them. A lot of folks are going to tell you to go with OEM which is normally the right thing to do but I absolutely couldn't afford to do OEM at the time and went with aftermarket injectors from Ebay. I have to say, they perform extremely well and have had no issues with them in three years. Only cost me $150 for a set of 6.
Like I said, I'm an OEM guy but because of the circumstances, I had to try them and not half bad. Flamethrowers I believe they were. You could also stab an OEM into #2 and call it good. I would use OEM if I were only doing one for sure.
Good work on getting to your root cause.
01-20-2017, 04:06 PM
#95
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You'll have to wait till the coil to plug continuity it tested.
I'm betting its electrical.
01-20-2017, 04:16 PM
#96
Well he did have the assortment of EGR system issues also. A bit of "chicken or egg", Did the the EGR injest debris or produce debris.
Atleast now it idles without crazy high RPM.
if the compression is good, and there is good spark. It might not even be a bad injector just a bad connection from all the work on that side of the engine. That 30 year old plastic gets mighty brittle for sure..
I get asked quite often why I prefer older vehicles "don't you worry about driving a car that old" well no I don't they're pretty darn tough and made of steel which is way better equipped to handle ageing than the plastic thing your driving. Sure the plastic technology has come a long way but it's still going to disintegrate from UV and heat.
Atleast now it idles without crazy high RPM.
if the compression is good, and there is good spark. It might not even be a bad injector just a bad connection from all the work on that side of the engine. That 30 year old plastic gets mighty brittle for sure..
I get asked quite often why I prefer older vehicles "don't you worry about driving a car that old" well no I don't they're pretty darn tough and made of steel which is way better equipped to handle ageing than the plastic thing your driving. Sure the plastic technology has come a long way but it's still going to disintegrate from UV and heat.
01-20-2017, 04:28 PM
#97
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Well My no 2 Sumitomo1988 has no continuity. Its as supple and flexible as you could ask given the industry its associated with. It really bugs me cause I have no faith in finding such a nice set of wires again. If I could just pull a new wire through this wire I'd rebuild it.... welllll Do they make original sealed wires like this any more?
injectors..... I should start collecting them. I get it.
injectors..... I should start collecting them. I get it.
01-20-2017, 04:35 PM
#100
Just a guess from the lathe addiction, not that there is anything wrong with that at all, you've got the machinery and probably some scrap plate laying about to cut a proper block off plate to sandwich in there and seal up. Fipg, might get that idle screw back to normal too.
