geoduke

I'm replacing my timing belt and having a tough time getting things finished up. I think I found the issue. Hopefully someone can point me in the right direction because of the pics.

I installed the belt with the crankshaft notch (not the pulley notch) lined up to the oil pump notch and then proceeded to line everything up from there (marks on the belt, marks on the camshaft, etc..). Everything lines up after cranking the crankshaft multiple times. The issue is that when I put the crankshaft pulley on, the pulley notch DOES NOT line up with 0 degrees TDC on the plastic housing.

The FSM manual says to line the crankshaft notch with the oil notch, install the belt, install the pulley, THEN rotate the pulley notch to TDC and install the belt on the camshaft.

What the heck is going on here???

http://imgur.com/a/6FlL4#E3ZwJ
The pics are pretty high resolution so click "image options" in imgur to see them full

xxxtreme22r

not the notch they are talking about. the notch they want you to line up to 0 which it should already be there when you put the pully on is the timing notch. What your calling a notch is the crank keyway.

xxxtreme22r

unless your talking about this one in which case it appears as though the crank moved after you took everything apart. Gonna have to take the belt off re-align the crank so that white mark is on 0. Align the cam's back up to the marks on the back of the cover and install the belt ensuring all 3 line up afterwards, as the drivers side ???? cam will want to rotate when you put the belt on and apply the tensioner. They need to line up AFTER the tensioner is on.

geoduke

If you look really close at this pic there is a very small notch at the top of the splined crankshaft timing pulley. This notch is superfluous?

When you say keyed are you talking about the key at the bottom of the pulley that the harmonic balancer slides over?

https://i.imgur.com/E3ZwJ.jpg
*removed image because of size, click link*

geoduke

Woah, sorry for the huge image. Gonna try and resize that.

xxxtreme22r

I remember that stupid notch, can't remember offhand I wanna say that photo is actually backwards or something like that, but I ignored it and used the timing mark on the crank pulley. As long as the notch on the balancer pulley is at 0 and the two marks on the cams are correct your good to go.

geoduke

I just installed everything with the crankshaft pulley notch pointing to 0 on the plastic timing cover. I kept the truck in gear so that the tension in the belt could not move the crankshaft and it would remain at 0. Doing this left me with not enough belt length to get the drivers side marks on the belt to reach the drivers side camshaft pulley. I had to force the pulley clockwise when looking at it to get the belt marks lined up with the pulley mark. When I routed the belt to the passenger side camshaft pulley I had to move that one over also to get room on the belt.

Basically, the camshafts have been forced two teeth clockwise because of holding the crankshaft at 0.

In the end, I'm at the same result. I'm either two teeth off on the camshafts or if I set those to point at the marks on the back plate, the crankshaft pulley mark gets moved into the same position that it was in my earlier pics.

Am I supposed to have the truck in gear the entire time to make sure the crankshaft doesn't move? If so, there is definitely not enough room on the belt to line the pulleys up with the factory marks and belt marks.

rworegon

Any chance you are putting the belt on backwards causing the marks to not line up? Remember, right and left are as if you are sitting in the driver seat.

geoduke

Yeah the belt was put on the right way. I'm beginning to wonder if the notch on the harmonic balancer is in the right place.

xxxtreme22r

This is not right if that's where it is.

geoduke

This is probably borderline obsessive but hey, I gotta get this thing running!

I think I've almost convinced myself that the notch on my harmonic balancer is in the wrong place. I dug up this thread and checked out some of the pics.



In this one he has the mark on his crankshaft lined up with the mark on the oil pan.



Here he says "installed the #1 timing belt cover and the harmonic balancer and notice if you have the dot lined up with the CR>>> on the new belt & the notch on the crank shaft pulley lined up with the timing mark on the oil pump body then when you install the cover and the harmonic balancer then the notch in the balancer pulley will line up with the "0" on the #1 timing belt cover"

It's important to take note of where the key was located on the crankshaft pulley and where the bolt holes are in relation to the notch on the harmonic balancer.

Now look at mine:



My key is in the same place (CS notch lined up with notch on oil pan)

Now look at my bolt pattern and notch location on the harmonic balancer!!!



The bolt pattern is in exactly the same position but the notch is between the two bolt holes and WAY off from 0 on the plastic cover. If my notch was clockwise more to where the bolt location is in the other pics, it would be right on zero!

I ordered another harmonic balancer from advance auto so I can compare. It will be in tomorrow and hopefully this will be put to rest.

Wrenchinjoe

Are you sure the harmonic balancer is fully seated on the key? It looks like the balancer is riding too far out on the CS and may not be seated on the key at all. See if you can remove the harmonic balancer, confirm the CS is still @ TDC, then reinstall the harmonic balancer in the correct position, lined up with 0* on the timing cover. You may have to 'persuade' it gently onto the key, mine was tight. It is possible you may simply not have the HB lined up.

If that is not the case, I notice the installation marks on the belt are also off in this photo. The crank shaft has been rotated from the original installation position, but perhaps you did that after installing the belt.

If it's not simply that the HB is not seated properly, I would remove the lower timing cover and start over. Make sure the CS does not rotate until the belt is fully routed around all pulleys and that all timing marks line up. Then rotate the CS 2 full revolutions and line it up to TDC (CS timing pulley notch aligned with oil pump hash mark). The cam pulley marks should be at 12:00 and lined up with their corresponding timing cover marks as well. (Pay no attention to the belt marks at this point, they only matter for the initial installation).

The harmonic balancer should point to 0* on the timing cover, assuming it is the same part that came off the engine when you began the job.

Good luck.

xxxtreme22r

does the VZ have a 2 piece balancer/crank pulley like the 22r does?

Wrenchinjoe

If memory serves it is a one piece, but the AC pulley bolts to the front of it once the CS bolt is torqued down.

xxxtreme22r

if it's a one piece then the O.P's thinking of the notch slipping causing the mis alignment of the timing notch is incorrect. I've seen the 22r's crank pulley either separate or rotate on itself before well not in person but a guy on here a while back had an issue with his timing mark rotating counter clockwise, turns out the balancer was bad and slipping.

Wrenchinjoe

I see what you are saying, mine was old and dirty. What I thought was a one-piece might have been two pieces pressed together and I didn't notice any seams. If that is the case then the replacement part should solve it. The timing notch lines up with an AC pulley bolt hole in the comparison pic, but sits between two AC bolt holes in the OP's pic. Interesting.

I am guessing he has it timed correctly as far as the timing belt installation is concerned, but either the harmonic balancer was never fully seated on the key correctly or the balancer has separated as you point out and is bad.

xxxtreme22r

funny thing is pretty much the exact thing happened with 8t84runner's truck when I noticed his timing mark wasn't at TDC. I took the FSM photo as being wrong set the notch as first stated at 0 degrees readjusted the timing belt and his runs 100% perfectly fine. For some stupid reason not mentioned yet was the fact I could have swore I saw somewhere that there is actually two notches on the vz crank pulley, but I couldn't find that info again so I took myself as being wrong as I didn't see two notches on his.

geoduke

My suspicions were confirmed today at advance auto and after I got my truck running tonight. Here's a shot of the balancer I ordered laying on top of the one from my truck, the internal key slots are lined up. Note the difference in notches between the two.

https://i.imgur.com/1Blx0.jpg

I came home and put my balancer on with the crankshaft groove lined up with the oil pan, marked it, and cut a new notch with a dremel. After that, put everything back and went about setting it to stock timing and idle based on the notch that I cut. The truck runs like a champ.

I never thought I'd say this but I can't wait to drive to work tomorrow.

xxxtreme22r

If I knew that that thing had slipped, I would have just put the new balancer on as it is gonna slip again.