Red Leader

You raise a good point. Everyone (especially new 'old' car buyers) needs to know that when folks say 'rust free', it is completely relative and only regarding immediate visual inspection at best. We got a 3rd gen from Maryland that was advertised as 'rust free'. Not sure I believed it, living in VA for several years, but in the pictures was clean. We bought the vehicle sight unseen but had my dad (who lives in N Virginia) go over it and have a hands-on inspection. Said it was great. And honestly, it was - for the location. Has more rust than both our other 4runners. It is this one...haha -

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f88/.../#post52341498

But! You couldn't really see any of the rust and to be fair had way less rust than your avg 19 yr old Maryland vehicle. Also got a great deal on it so it was still a great buy AND it made an 1800 mile road trip right after. So that is a really good thing to remember. Rust free? When was the last time they checked the inside lip of the wheelwell pinchwelds?

L5wolvesf

I think "rust free" on any vehicle is a dream even in the desert. Deserts do get rain and places on old cars where water or wet debris collect will rust. They are just hard to see.

thook

My wife's '92 was rust free when we got it. Does this mean a dream came true?

Red Leader

I dunno, did you get it in '92?

thook

Nope!!...haha! We got it sometime around 2004-5. It wasn't used hard, but it came with a rebuilt engine at a tad over 20k on the rebuild usage. The bottom end exploded not long after we had it. Someone didn't do something right....hehe. (wuddn me, either )

L5wolvesf

Well it sounds like a dream came true until the bottom end exploded.

thook

Chalk it up to a glitch in the matrix...

It all worked out well in the end. I learned about Toyotas and we now have a motor I know exactly what's up with. Well, except the mystery lean code I keep getting....ppffttth

ewong

"mystery lean code"

Is it actually throwing a Check Engine Light and a LEAN signal?

Im not sure if the 3.0L V6 had it, but the 22RE had a "Vf" signal.
This is a somewhat undocumented signal, but it indicates of the level of "fuel trim" the ECU is doing in an attempt to make the 02 sensor happy.
Its a "rough" percentage of add or delete from the injector pulse width to get the 02 to scroll so that the ECU is in range.

http://www.well.com/user/mosk/Vfsignal.htm

I actually have BOTH an "LED" sensor on the O2 sensor as well as the "Vf" that Jeff Moskowitz used to make/sell.

It has been helpful in diagnosing my "move the spring" mods to the AFM flapper in conjunction with my "slightly larger than stock flow" "disc" injector conversion...

thook

Thank you for interjecting, ewong! Yes, a CEL and code 25. It's been a little while since I've tried tracking down the problem, but I recall going through and troubleshooting everything that could possibly be related all the way back to the ECU. IOW's, testing sensors at the ECU to make sure it wasn't a wiring problem. I'd even checked the valve clearances, had the injectors serviced, checked the plenum for possible warping, replaced upper and lower intake gaskets....just all kinds of crap. The idle is poopy, too, but the IAC valve passed my inspection. I need to muster the time and inspiration to try once again to find the issue. I've just had enough going on with other things that I've not been up to it.

I'll have to go back and reference the FSM, but a Vf signal rings a bell. Of course, I could be crossing brain wires and recalling diagnostics I've done on my 22re.

thook

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f116...iagram-254269/

I knew Vf sounded familiar. I remember checking O2 function and it passing, but I don't remember how I checked it/at which port terminals. I'll have to revisit all that.

L5wolvesf

Are there any advantages or disadvantages to a 1st gen (84–89) vs. a 2nd gen (90–95)?

millball

Although the driveline mechanicals are similar between first and second gen Runners, they're otherwise completely different.

First gens are all 2 door body style with a removable fiberglas top.

2nd gens are 4 door non-removable steel topped trucks. There is also a very rarely seen early 2 door steel top Runner.

thook

2nd gen's have coil springs in the rear. And, atleast V6's had larger calipers up front. Not sure if 1st gen V6 had'em. Someone feel free to clarify that. And, you decide on the advantage vs disadvantage. I know my 2nd gen is a lot better at stopping a loaded trailer, though.

millball

I know for sure that the '92 and up V6 Runners have larger calipers and thicker rotors than 1st gen 4cyl Runners do.

I retrofitted them from a 6cyl '92 to my '87 4cyl Runner to good effect.

Can't say for sure about earlier models brakes than '92

L5wolvesf

I knew about the fiberglass top, didn't know about the door configurations. Advantage 2nd Gen for my purposes.
Thank you

L5wolvesf

The better brakes are an advantage since I would probably be towing some with it. Advantage 2nd Gen.

I read some talk here about the rear coils sagging, except most of the cures involve a lift over stock height.
I would want a heavier spring more for load and maybe a small lift.

thook

Like the 1st gens, the saggy rear is definitely common. After researching the web for best solutions (and cheapest), I got some Moog springs for ours. Didn't need the lift at all. Sits up nice and perky in the rear....more so even than it did when got it. As well, unless it's a particularly heavy load (read: more than I really should be hauling...hehe), the vehicle still sits level. And, of course, it depends on your trailer and how you load it. Lastly, the vehicle still rides very nicely as opposed to throwing some heavy duty thing on there so it rides like a brick horse until it's loaded.

dropzone

iTrader: (6)

Pulling codes

thook

Is there a particular reason you posted that video, dropzone?

BTW, love your 1st gen truck!! Is that an aftermarket sunroof you installed?

L5wolvesf

I can't say this is why he posted that but my guess would be something that I've been thinking about - computerized vehicles.
I'm a dinosaur compared to some guys here. I obviously have computers (several actually) and I repaired them for a while (in the 90s) so I'm not unfamiliar with them. But a when vehicle's computer takes a dump you're literally stuck. With a computer you have backup (you ALL do right? and you fix it without being stranded.

If or when I get a 4Runner it will likely be the newest vehicle I've owned, and the only one very dependent on the ECU.
It will be an additional vehicle to my "fleet" so I won't be stuck if it breaks - as long as I'm not on a road trip if it does.
One reason I like Toyota is the one's I've had, have been very dependable - knock on wood (my head)