4.10's and 33's

blainelukens · 02-14-2006, 11:42 PM

ok so I have a 89 PU 5 speed with a 3.0 with 4.10's, want to eventually put 33's on preferably 33x12.5. Although I assume that I would need to re-gear the diffs??? Is this correct, anyone out there run this setup? How slugish is your truck, any other disadvantages? Not sure what I should do, or if I re-gear what I should go to b/c this truck is a daily driver and would like to maintain highway speeds of about 70-80 miles per hour. Any suggestions would help alot
Thanks

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tc · 02-15-2006, 04:02 AM

4.10's are going to be a major problem with 33's.

I run 33's with 4.56's and there was a slight but noticeable loss of power when I change from 31's. I am considering going to 4.88's to get back closer to the stock ratio.

I would recommend you look into 33x10.50 - a lot easier to fit on our trucks.

jacksonpt · 02-15-2006, 05:10 AM

It's all about personal preference. I run 33/12.5-15s on my truck with stock 3.90s. Yes, it's on the slow side, but for the most part I don't mind it (only after driving a vehicle with some zip do I notice how lethargic my truck is going up hill, but it only takes me a few days to get used to my truck again).

FWIW... I have the 3.4 V6 in my truck... might make a difference.

fourwd1 · 02-15-2006, 09:49 AM

You'll have a slight loss of power, but many, many people run 33's w/stock 4.10 gears and live with it, and w/4 cyl engines.

Drive it for a while w/the 33's and then decide. If you do re-gear go w/4.56 or 4.88s.

Diesel_Freak · 02-15-2006, 03:25 PM

well, 4.10's +22RE + 31X10.50's = Crappy acceleration and slugish feel... seeing as the 3.Slow doesn't feel much pepier, I'd say go to 4.88's Minimum... if you're gonna go to bigger tires eventualy I'd go to 5.29's... 33X10.50's are next up[ for my truck, and I think I'm gonna get soem 4.88's done up with a Detroit out back...

90runnner · 02-15-2006, 05:05 PM

teehee 4.10's and 35x12.50's. im a bad boy

deathrunner · 02-19-2006, 11:18 AM

I ran 33's and 4.10s behind my 22re for 2 years. It is slow as hell. You have to slip 1st gear to get rolling, even on the slightest incline. 4th gear acts as a really high 5th gear and 5th gear is completely useless.

4.88's and 33's are great. It stillisn't gonna be a speed demon, but it actual pulls in the propper ranges now.

Silver_Truck · 02-19-2006, 12:05 PM

4.10s 33s and the v6 will be fine i ran it for 8-9 months and yes its slower but i lived with it just fine I could do 70 and go up hills, for the most part i only really noticed it when going off road or trying to accelerate fromn a stop on STEEP hills (not regular hills) 4.88s are spot on for 34s for 33s you'll be a bit overgeared but theres nothing you can do about that as they're as close as you'll get. Just put the 33s on and drive it you'll be able to save up for gears while still being able to drive and wheel. Also Search we've had so many threads on this topic lately.

4Mogger · 02-19-2006, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel_Freak

well, 4.10's +22RE + 31X10.50's = Crappy acceleration and slugish feel... seeing as the 3.Slow doesn't feel much pepier, I'd say go to 4.88's Minimum... if you're gonna go to bigger tires eventualy I'd go to 5.29's... 33X10.50's are next up[ for my truck, and I think I'm gonna get soem 4.88's done up with a Detroit out back...

X2. Toyotas like to rev and 4.88's would be the absolute minimum. I would just go 5.71 and with 33's in 5th gear at 60mph= 3129 rpm. Anything less will make 5th gear pretty useless. And you know you will eventually have at least 35's on there so may as well just do it once.

tc · 02-19-2006, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Mogger

X2. Toyotas like to rev and 4.88's would be the absolute minimum. I would just go 5.71 and with 33's in 5th gear at 60mph= 3129 rpm. Anything less will make 5th gear pretty useless. And you know you will eventually have at least 35's on there so may as well just do it once.

Umm .. yeah - but we "normal" people probably need to take your gearing advise with a grain of salt LOL ... what is the effective ratio of the 4Mogger by the time you get through all the reduction?

I know the engine "likes" it, but I still can't bring myself to accept the sound of it revving so high all the time...

JEDI87 · 02-19-2006, 07:19 PM

Well,on my 87 with a 22re and 235/75/15's and 4.10 gears was decent.I installed a 3" body lift and 33's and it was a dog,but do able.It was like that for about 3 years till I installed a fully built 22re,climbed and accellerated better but it wasn't enough.I dropped in some 4.88's and WOW!what a difference.The rpm's are right in the sweet spot now and I have no problem climbing the 3,500 ft. drive to work everyday and actually pass people now.I was neck and neck with a 3rd gen the otherday!

-MaTTi- · 02-24-2006, 11:45 AM

I like my 4.10 gears with 33x10.50R15. Just optimal, I think (for good torque diesel engine).

***midiwall*** · 02-24-2006, 02:56 PM

This guide can give you an idea of what to expect...
http://www.4wheelparts.com/4wp/asset...gear-ratio.htm

Don't take the RPMs as exact, that will of course depend on your final gear ratio, but the chart will show you how RPMs will change in terms of percentages.

BAZ · 02-24-2006, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midiwall

This guide can give you an idea of what to expect...
http://www.4wheelparts.com/4wp/asset...gear-ratio.htm

Don't take the RPMs as exact, that will of course depend on your final gear ratio, but the chart will show you how RPMs will change in terms of percentages.

Wow, nice chart. Apparently 4.10's (well, 4.11's) would yield "best overall performance"w/33's.

I wonder how much width plays into that. Like a 10.5" versus a 12.5" width.

LOCKnGO · 02-24-2006, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BAZ

Wow, nice chart. Apparently 4.10's (well, 4.11's) would yield "best overall performance"w/33's.

I wonder how much width plays into that. Like a 10.5" versus a 12.5" width.

Damn 4.11 and 35" tires puts me in the blue? I remember my gas milage was way better back I had 33"s. Also stop and go traffic wasn't so bad either.

On the trail thats a different story though.

***midiwall*** · 02-24-2006, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BAZ

I wonder how much width plays into that. Like a 10.5" versus a 12.5" width.

There was a thread around here somewhere that talked about this - "this" being the rolling resistance. If I remember right, someone showed the math behind the amount of tread in contact with the road in both cases then worked out what the added resistance (when moving from 10.5" to 12.5") would cost you in economy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOCKnGO

Damn 4.11 and 35" tires puts me in the blue? I remember my gas milage was way better back I had 33"s. Also stop and go traffic wasn't so bad either.

Remember that chart is a guideline, it doesn't take into account your tranny gear ratio, only the rearend. But in general, moving to a larger tire without regearing will reduce the engine RPMs needed to maintain a certain speed. If the engine's running slower, then it's using less fuel, and of course that's better economy.

Try this... Head out onto the highway, hold 65mph and note the engine RPMs (the more accurate the better of course). Then come back to that chart and lookup your present tire size against your rearend ratio. Divide the RPM number on the chart into the real world number you got on the highway. That's your "multiplier" for the rest of the chart. Now you can apply that multiplier across the other numbers to get a feel for what your real world will be with other tires/gears.

For example, I run 31" tires and have a 4.11 final. The chart says "2896" for RPM which is WAY high for me (I'm an auto with overdrive).

My real world at 65 is around 2100, so I would:

2100/2896 = 0.72513812

Which means that if I went to 33's, and stayed with a 4.11 rearend, then my new RPMs should be:

2720 * 0.73 = 1986

Now, the whole color thing is "weird" as well. They're thinking based on how efficient an unknown benchmark engine is. It could be a inline 4 that likes to run fast, or a V8 that pulls a lot of torque out of the bottom.

So, don't look at the coloring as some hot zone that you should be sitting in. If your engine runs "well" in the RPM zone it's in with your current tire size, then you have to again use your multiplier to figure on what you'd need to do for gearing to get back to where you were.

BASICALLY - while I think that chart has some merit, it's generally useless without being tweaked for the engine and _overall_ gearing for a specific application. It looks pretty, but it's not an end all know-it-all.

I posted it it so that you can see the "delta" (percentage of difference) of change based on tire size and gearing.

EDIT: hahaha... LOCKnGO, I just noticed your sig "if it's simple, then it's wrong". That describes this chart.

tc · 02-24-2006, 07:48 PM

Those charts don't work for Toyota - they are all designed around domestic full size trucks. Our transmission ratios are much lower to make up for the limited engine displacement. Our engines LIKE to be revved a little bit, so going higher gearing will actually hurt your fuel economy.

You can use the actual calculator on http://www.4wheelparts.com/4wp/ORS/gear_calculator.asp

Bobakazi · 02-25-2006, 10:53 AM

I ran 4.10s with 33's for 10 years. It was fine. Of course, I do not view my truck as a race car, and I never pulled anything. It is all perspective. On the other hand, I really do like my setup now, and would not go back. It's a money thing. If you can easily afford it, change the gears of course. Otherwise, run your 33's with your stock gears and see if you like it.

kyle_22r · 02-25-2006, 11:46 AM

i run 4.10s with my 30x9.5 tires on my '91 truck. i have no problems getting up to speed on the freeway or driving around town. actually, it'd be better if i replaced my clutch as that's the limiting factor for me(probably the original, some woman owned the truck before me), since if i hit the gas hard in 4th gear it'll break loose and slip.

02-15-2006, 04:02 AM	#2 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,372	4.10's are going to be a major problem with 33's. I run 33's with 4.56's and there was a slight but noticeable loss of power when I change from 31's. I am considering going to 4.88's to get back closer to the stock ratio. I would recommend you look into 33x10.50 - a lot easier to fit on our trucks. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-15-2006, 05:10 AM	#3 (permalink)
jacksonpt Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Binghamton, NY Posts: 2,753	It's all about personal preference. I run 33/12.5-15s on my truck with stock 3.90s. Yes, it's on the slow side, but for the most part I don't mind it (only after driving a vehicle with some zip do I notice how lethargic my truck is going up hill, but it only takes me a few days to get used to my truck again). FWIW... I have the 3.4 V6 in my truck... might make a difference. __________________ Jackson - My Site 96 SR5 4x4 - 33" MTs, open diffs, and 3.90s - LET'S ROCK! My runner has bee traded in sniff on an 06 SR5 long bed d-cab Tacoma. The tacoma is nice, but... sniff ... I'll update my site when I'm done grieving.

02-15-2006, 09:49 AM	#4 (permalink)
fourwd1 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: central Maryland Posts: 193	You'll have a slight loss of power, but many, many people run 33's w/stock 4.10 gears and live with it, and w/4 cyl engines. Drive it for a while w/the 33's and then decide. If you do re-gear go w/4.56 or 4.88s. __________________ - - As seen in FOUR WHEELEER magazine July 2006, OFF-ROAD magazine Feb 2007 - - '84 4Runner SR5 - ARBed 5.29s F&R, 4.7 t-case, drv train lift, Chevys, hi-steer, 30 spl Longs '80 something Toy P/U, Buick 231 V6, Holley 4 bbl, Weiand intake, Downey headers, custom TH350 L/U w/700R4 low gearset, dual tanks, dual batterys

02-15-2006, 03:25 PM	#5 (permalink)
Diesel_Freak Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: PDX, Oregon Posts: 420	well, 4.10's +22RE + 31X10.50's = Crappy acceleration and slugish feel... seeing as the 3.Slow doesn't feel much pepier, I'd say go to 4.88's Minimum... if you're gonna go to bigger tires eventualy I'd go to 5.29's... 33X10.50's are next up[ for my truck, and I think I'm gonna get soem 4.88's done up with a Detroit out back... __________________ Project 4Rescue: 89 Gen1 22RE 5spd 4Runner...Marlin DOM rear bumper, OME rear/ BJ spacer front, OME shocks all around. Lucas Pro series HD clutch: DONE!!! BRAND SPANKIN NEW 22RE DONE!!!!! Firefighters: Cause somebody's got to step up and do it... RIP: Charles Edward DelaForest: Born Sept 78 - Murdered May 05 I miss you Brother

02-15-2006, 05:05 PM	#6 (permalink)
90runnner Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Newport News, VA Posts: 366	teehee 4.10's and 35x12.50's. im a bad boy __________________ <===i miss that one Mine: 1991 Landcruiser 2in OME lift 33in BFG A/T's The girl's: 2001 4runner 3in Revtek, 3in body lift 35in MT Baja Claws Marlin sliders TJM front bumper

02-19-2006, 11:18 AM	#7 (permalink)
deathrunner Registered User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: San Diego CA Posts: 2,971	I ran 33's and 4.10s behind my 22re for 2 years. It is slow as hell. You have to slip 1st gear to get rolling, even on the slightest incline. 4th gear acts as a really high 5th gear and 5th gear is completely useless. 4.88's and 33's are great. It stillisn't gonna be a speed demon, but it actual pulls in the propper ranges now. __________________ IFS IS FOR LOSERS Decroded Piece of Crap

02-19-2006, 12:05 PM	#8 (permalink)
Silver_Truck Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: B'ham, WA Posts: 1,820	4.10s 33s and the v6 will be fine i ran it for 8-9 months and yes its slower but i lived with it just fine I could do 70 and go up hills, for the most part i only really noticed it when going off road or trying to accelerate fromn a stop on STEEP hills (not regular hills) 4.88s are spot on for 34s for 33s you'll be a bit overgeared but theres nothing you can do about that as they're as close as you'll get. Just put the 33s on and drive it you'll be able to save up for gears while still being able to drive and wheel. Also Search we've had so many threads on this topic lately. __________________ -Geoff *1991 Toyota Pickup Ext. Cab SR5 4x4 V6 5 spd K&N intake, port & polished heads with OS valves, port & polished intake manifold and plenum, NWOR headers and crossover, NWOR catback, Denso Iridium plugs, Redline Fluids, 4.88s, Rear LockRight, Aisin hubs, Chevy springs, BJ spacers, 2" RB body lift, 34x10.5 Swamper LTBs, WolphisWorks Sliders and bumpers, 400,000 mi.

02-19-2006, 07:19 PM	#11 (permalink)
JEDI87 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Gardnerville,Nv./South Lake Tahoe Posts: 854	Well,on my 87 with a 22re and 235/75/15's and 4.10 gears was decent.I installed a 3" body lift and 33's and it was a dog,but do able.It was like that for about 3 years till I installed a fully built 22re,climbed and accellerated better but it wasn't enough.I dropped in some 4.88's and WOW!what a difference.The rpm's are right in the sweet spot now and I have no problem climbing the 3,500 ft. drive to work everyday and actually pass people now.I was neck and neck with a 3rd gen the otherday! __________________ http://members.cardomain.com./jedi87 Old Toys 87 4runner 94 truck 914runner 99 4runner 95 Tacoma New Toy Stage 3 02 Audi S4

02-24-2006, 11:45 AM	#12 (permalink)
-MaTTi- Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Finland Posts: 140	I like my 4.10 gears with 33x10.50R15. Just optimal, I think (for good torque diesel engine). __________________ 1996 Toyota Land Cruiser KZJ90 -2" homemade bodylift + 1.25" Daystar top plate spacers at front -Cooper Discoverer STT 33x12.50R17 tires on 8x17" Dotz Luxor wheels -Water-Intercooler -3" downpipe + exhaust

02-24-2006, 02:56 PM	#13 (permalink)
*midiwall* Sponsoring Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Seattleish, WA Posts: 9,078	This guide can give you an idea of what to expect... http://www.4wheelparts.com/4wp/asset...gear-ratio.htm Don't take the RPMs as exact, that will of course depend on your final gear ratio, but the chart will show you how RPMs will change in terms of percentages. __________________ ~ Mark '96 4Runner Limited S/C MI - 370cc injectors, Air! horns, Airaid MIT, ATS A-arms, 285/75/R16 BFG MTs, Bored TB, Brembo slotted, Cobra 75 WXST, Deckplate, Downey headers, Hayden cooler, IPT valve body, Level 10 torque convertor, Meanstreak exhaust, OME/OME rears, On-board PC (XM, Nav, WiFi, etc), Port 'n Polish, Remote Start, SAW fronts, Hilux console, SMT-5, Stubb's sliders, Supra MAF, TJM-17, 2.0" pulley, Viair 450c, Walbro 190, Weasy2k cams

02-24-2006, 07:48 PM	#17 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,372	Those charts don't work for Toyota - they are all designed around domestic full size trucks. Our transmission ratios are much lower to make up for the limited engine displacement. Our engines LIKE to be revved a little bit, so going higher gearing will actually hurt your fuel economy. You can use the actual calculator on http://www.4wheelparts.com/4wp/ORS/gear_calculator.asp __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-25-2006, 10:53 AM	#18 (permalink)
Bobakazi Registered User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 379	I ran 4.10s with 33's for 10 years. It was fine. Of course, I do not view my truck as a race car, and I never pulled anything. It is all perspective. On the other hand, I really do like my setup now, and would not go back. It's a money thing. If you can easily afford it, change the gears of course. Otherwise, run your 33's with your stock gears and see if you like it. __________________ '90 Extra cab V6 4x4 PU 5.29 gears. Detroit locker front, Detroit Truetrac rear. 35" BFG mudders. Trailmaster 4" susp, 3" body lifts. Add-a-leaf. K+N intake, 2.5" exhaust with Flowmaster 40 and a cat I got off an Evo VIII.

02-25-2006, 11:46 AM	#19 (permalink)
kyle_22r Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lacey, WA Posts: 3,992	i run 4.10s with my 30x9.5 tires on my '91 truck. i have no problems getting up to speed on the freeway or driving around town. actually, it'd be better if i replaced my clutch as that's the limiting factor for me(probably the original, some woman owned the truck before me), since if i hit the gas hard in 4th gear it'll break loose and slip. __________________ 1998 tacoma, 3RZ-FE, 5 speed, 30x9.5R15 M/Ts past toys: 1984 4x2 1979 4x4 1991 4x4

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