paint or powder coat? Knuckle/hub rebuild

live4soccer7 · 10-25-2009, 09:55 PM

I'm in the stage of rebuilding my hubs and knuckles. I figured while I have everything torn down I may as well start cleaning stuff and paint it or powder coat it. My neighbor has the stuff for powder coating and he is really good at it. I could also paint them too. What are suggestions for that kind of stuff and if paint what kind of paint would be good. I always see people paint their axle housing and all that stuff black (maybe it's powder coated?), but I'm not sure what kind of paint they are using (can or out of a spray gun?).

Any info on this would be much appreciated.

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malteserunner · 10-25-2009, 10:04 PM

IMO powdercoat it for show, paint it if you are going to wheel it. I'm sure you will get different points of view. Most of the paint you see are just rattle can jobs. You will want to use the appropriate products for your particular environment. I live in California, so I don't have concerns with rust, and I use Krylon or Duplicolor's High Heat spray paint. Some others I've seen use POR or other rust inhibiting paints. Good luck and have fun.

live4soccer7 · 10-25-2009, 10:16 PM

Wouldn't powder coat outlast paint, actually I know it would. What's the downside to it I suppose (besides not being able to remove it). I've heard of epoxy paint, not familiar with it though. Still not sure what to do or product to use.

Etype R · 10-25-2009, 10:22 PM

Are you going to wheel? or is it a daily driver?

I rattle can everything under my truck. I use Dupli-color truck paint, Krylon, and Rustoleum hammer finish paints. Also make sure to use a primer that goes with the paint you are using. Prep is key to making anything stick.

live4soccer7 · 10-25-2009, 10:33 PM

I'll wheel and daily drive it. It'll be used for both. Obviously no serious wheeling, but still having fun. Yes, I know prep is everything. I've painted a lot of plastics in my time, but nothing metal really. Out of the three brands mentioned, which do you like best as far as looks and durability?

malteserunner · 10-25-2009, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by live4soccer7

Wouldn't powder coat outlast paint, actually I know it would. What's the downside to it I suppose (besides not being able to remove it). I've heard of epoxy paint, not familiar with it though. Still not sure what to do or product to use.

Powder coat will chip off when you hit rocks and things off road. You won't be able to touch it up like paint. Also, after powder coating your parts, you will need to clearance certain areas before re-installation, if tolerances are tight. Again, best of luck with whatever you decide, and post some pics.

malteserunner · 10-25-2009, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by live4soccer7

I'll wheel and daily drive it. It'll be used for both. Obviously no serious wheeling, but still having fun. Yes, I know prep is everything. I've painted a lot of plastics in my time, but nothing metal really. Out of the three brands mentioned, which do you like best as far as looks and durability?

I rattle canned my 4Runner's body with Rustoleum OD Green. I liked the coverage, but disliked the spray tip. My bumpers are primed and painted with Krylon. It's cheap and I love the fan tip. I use the gray Krylon primer because the black primer doesn't cover well. I've used the Duplicolor High Heat on bumpers before, and it holds up well, it just costs more than Krylon.

live4soccer7 · 10-25-2009, 10:59 PM

for example, this truck. Is that painted (can/gun) or powder coated? I'll be sure to post up pics as I make decent progress. I'm still in the tear down phase.

I'm referring to the axle housing and the linkages.

Gnarly4X · 10-26-2009, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malteserunner

IMO powdercoat it for show, paint it if you are going to wheel it. I'm sure you will get different points of view. Most of the paint you see are just rattle can jobs. You will want to use the appropriate products for your particular environment. I live in California, so I don't have concerns with rust, and I use Krylon or Duplicolor's High Heat spray paint. Some others I've seen use POR or other rust inhibiting paints. Good luck and have fun.

2X

gNARLS.

Gnarly4X · 10-26-2009, 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by malteserunner

Powder coat will chip off when you hit rocks and things off road. You won't be able to touch it up like paint. Also, after powder coating your parts, you will need to clearance certain areas before re-installation, if tolerances are tight. Again, best of luck with whatever you decide, and post some pics.

3X

gNARLS.

James Dean · 10-26-2009, 06:05 AM

Powder coating is not as tough as most people think. It will fade, scratch and chip. A good catalyzed spray paint will hold up pretty good for your application. Plus if it gets damaged you can scuff it a re-shoot it. Rattle can paint has no hardener and so has no chemical resistance. First time you hit it with a strong degreaser or brake cleaner it can ruin it.

I'm not saying to not powder coat your stuff. I have whole frames, suspension and trailers powder coated. Mainly because it was easier to have someone else do all the work on tube or channel parts. But on parts that might get beat up or scratched I would just paint them.

Wardamneagle · 10-26-2009, 10:21 AM

POR15 with their chassis black topcoat. If you apply it per their directions you won't be able to beat it off with a hammer.

stagger_lee · 10-26-2009, 10:33 AM

Definitely would not powder coat the axle housing being that it is closer to rocks and dirt kicking up. Wheels I might consider, but why spend the money when you have pretty good quality rattle can products out there. IMO Put the money into something else.

4Crawler · 10-26-2009, 10:59 AM

x4 on paint over powder coat. Aside from the issues noted above, with powder coat, you apply if over clean, typically freshly sand blasted, steel. If that coating is compromised, that bare steel underneath will start to rust quickly and that rust can travel up under the intact coating and cause it to bubble up. I like the POR-15 on my axle, if you do the acid etch metal prep, the steel is left with a zinc phosphate coating that is rust resistant. I find the scratched area will start to rust but it will not work it's way under the paint. So you can easily touch it up and it is as good as new.

live4soccer7 · 10-26-2009, 09:39 PM

That's what I'm going with. Going to source some of the stuff right now. Thanks

live4soccer7 · 10-26-2009, 09:44 PM

I'm guessing this is the stuff you guys are talking about?

http://www.por15.com/POR-15/productinfo/1GB/
http://www.por15.com/METAL-READY/productinfo/MRG/
http://www.por15.com/MARINE-CLEAN/productinfo/MCG/

Can someone confirm this before I go ahead and purchase. Also, if you know of a cheaper place to get it feel free to throw that out there. Thanks.

I've been reading more on the website. Anyone recommend the following: clear coat, topcoat or the primer?

874runnersr5 · 10-26-2009, 09:45 PM

If doing anything, do por15

Agent Orange · 10-26-2009, 09:49 PM

I've worked with a sandblaster/powder coater. Powder coat would be my number one pick for wheels, the frame, diff cover, axle housings, things like that. A good, professional job with a media blasted part with hold up great for chips, scrapes, etc. It's even what I did to my mountain bike.

But for things like hubs and anything that needs to move/slide/rotate or anything with some tighter tolerances, I say aerosol it for sure. Not worth adding crap on things you need to move or adjust and risking it be in the way.

4Crawler · 10-26-2009, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by live4soccer7

I'm guessing this is the stuff you guys are talking about?

http://www.por15.com/POR-15/productinfo/1GB/
http://www.por15.com/METAL-READY/productinfo/MRG/
http://www.por15.com/MARINE-CLEAN/productinfo/MCG/

Can someone confirm this before I go ahead and purchase. Also, if you know of a cheaper place to get it feel free to throw that out there. Thanks.

Yep, you can use any decent cleaner for the metal in place of Marine Clean, something like Simple Green or similar, just needs to degrease it well. And if on a budget, you can use something like CLR or LimeAway in place of the Metal Ready. All are phosphoric acid based and will etch the bare steel. What you give up with not using the Metal Ready is the zinc content with adds a slight yellow tint to the etched steel (like the yellow on Grade 8 bolts). But you need the POR-15 primer then a top coat, I like the Chassis Black top coat but there are other choices.

And read and FOLLOW the directions to the letter. Unlike most paints where the directions are like suggestions, the POR-15 directions must be followed to the letter. I like 1 primer coat and 2 top coats and try to get them done in a day. Tricky part is getting the primer drying time pegged, it can be anywhere from a little over an hour to 4 or more hours (highly dependent on weather, temperature and humidity and not the way you would expect). If you wait until it dries hard, then you need to wait a few days and rough it up with sand paper before top coating.

live4soccer7 · 10-26-2009, 10:02 PM

Well I plan on doing it right, so I may as well get the products they offer. I plan on doing a lot of stuff on this project and down the road.

So I need to get the following:

Marine Clean
Metal Ready
Por 15 (rust preventative coating, this different than the top coat?)
Primer
Top Coat

So 5 things total?

4Crawler · 10-26-2009, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by live4soccer7

Well I plan on doing it right, so I may as well get the products they offer. I plan on doing a lot of stuff on this project and down the road.

So I need to get the following:

Marine Clean
Metal Ready
Por 15 (rust preventative coating, this different than the top coat?)
Primer
Top Coat

So 5 things total?

POR-15 basic paint:
- http://www.por15.com/POR-15/productinfo/1GB/
I consider it a primer since it is meant to go over bare metal and generally needs to be top coated.

Some top coat offerings from POR-15::
- http://www.por15.com/Single-Part-Topcoats/products/4/
- http://www.por15.com/2-Part-Topcoats/products/5/

live4soccer7 · 10-26-2009, 11:26 PM

alright... so the cleaning agents (2 items) the basic por15 and the topcoat.

4 items in all right?

tmcorbin · 10-27-2009, 03:19 AM

How much POR15 and top coat do you need for an entire frame, front and rear axle housing?

Thanks

4Crawler · 10-27-2009, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by live4soccer7

alright... so the cleaning agents (2 items) the basic por15 and the topcoat.

4 items in all right?

Yep, that should be the complete kit.

4Crawler · 10-27-2009, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmcorbin

How much POR15 and top coat do you need for an entire frame, front and rear axle housing?

Thanks

A quart of each should do it.

10-25-2009, 10:04 PM	#2 (permalink)
malteserunner Contributing Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Ca Posts: 520	IMO powdercoat it for show, paint it if you are going to wheel it. I'm sure you will get different points of view. Most of the paint you see are just rattle can jobs. You will want to use the appropriate products for your particular environment. I live in California, so I don't have concerns with rust, and I use Krylon or Duplicolor's High Heat spray paint. Some others I've seen use POR or other rust inhibiting paints. Good luck and have fun. __________________ 87 4Runner, 22re, 5 spd, 4.88, ARB rear, Mile Marker PE8000, Downey Header, TG Sliders, 3" BL, Home Fab Front and Rear Bumper, WabFab Bikini Top, Rustoleum OD Green. Build Thread 98 Tacoma Prerunner, 2.7, 340k. 91 4Runner, V6. 5 speed, Pro Comp lift, 33's, Rock Crawlers. Sold. Parting Out- 97 T-100

10-25-2009, 10:22 PM	#4 (permalink)
Etype R Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 294	Are you going to wheel? or is it a daily driver? I rattle can everything under my truck. I use Dupli-color truck paint, Krylon, and Rustoleum hammer finish paints. Also make sure to use a primer that goes with the paint you are using. Prep is key to making anything stick. __________________ 1985 Toyota 4Runner - Full SR5 package - 4 inch lift - 35" tires

10-25-2009, 10:59 PM	#8 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	for example, this truck. Is that painted (can/gun) or powder coated? I'll be sure to post up pics as I make decent progress. I'm still in the tear down phase. I'm referring to the axle housing and the linkages. Attached Thumbnails

10-26-2009, 06:05 AM	#11 (permalink)
James Dean Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 582	Powder coating is not as tough as most people think. It will fade, scratch and chip. A good catalyzed spray paint will hold up pretty good for your application. Plus if it gets damaged you can scuff it a re-shoot it. Rattle can paint has no hardener and so has no chemical resistance. First time you hit it with a strong degreaser or brake cleaner it can ruin it. I'm not saying to not powder coat your stuff. I have whole frames, suspension and trailers powder coated. Mainly because it was easier to have someone else do all the work on tube or channel parts. But on parts that might get beat up or scratched I would just paint them. __________________ Custom painter and Toyota Stripe and decal supplier. http://jamesdeancreations.com Custom Safari and Crawlin accessories. http://www.jamesdeancreations.com/4runner_project.htm

10-26-2009, 10:21 AM	#12 (permalink)
Wardamneagle Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: UK and Gulf Shores, AL Posts: 322	POR15 with their chassis black topcoat. If you apply it per their directions you won't be able to beat it off with a hammer. __________________ 1985 4Runner 1997 FZJ 80 2007 HDJ100 - DD

10-25-2009, 10:16 PM	#3 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	Wouldn't powder coat outlast paint, actually I know it would. What's the downside to it I suppose (besides not being able to remove it). I've heard of epoxy paint, not familiar with it though. Still not sure what to do or product to use.

10-25-2009, 10:33 PM	#5 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	I'll wheel and daily drive it. It'll be used for both. Obviously no serious wheeling, but still having fun. Yes, I know prep is everything. I've painted a lot of plastics in my time, but nothing metal really. Out of the three brands mentioned, which do you like best as far as looks and durability?

10-26-2009, 10:59 AM	#14 (permalink)
4Crawler Contributing Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SF Bay Area, CA Posts: 7,828	x4 on paint over powder coat. Aside from the issues noted above, with powder coat, you apply if over clean, typically freshly sand blasted, steel. If that coating is compromised, that bare steel underneath will start to rust quickly and that rust can travel up under the intact coating and cause it to bubble up. I like the POR-15 on my axle, if you do the acid etch metal prep, the steel is left with a zinc phosphate coating that is rust resistant. I find the scratched area will start to rust but it will not work it's way under the paint. So you can easily touch it up and it is as good as new. __________________ 1985 Toyota 4Runner SR-5, 22REC engine, dual t-cases, 4.88 gears, dual ARBs, 33x10.50 BFGs or 35x12.50 MTRs r.c.brown@ieee.org TruckEditor@tlca.org Project: 4Crawler 4Crawler OffRoad Gettin'Off 4WD Club

10-26-2009, 09:39 PM	#15 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	That's what I'm going with. Going to source some of the stuff right now. Thanks

10-26-2009, 09:44 PM	#16 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	I'm guessing this is the stuff you guys are talking about? http://www.por15.com/POR-15/productinfo/1GB/ http://www.por15.com/METAL-READY/productinfo/MRG/ http://www.por15.com/MARINE-CLEAN/productinfo/MCG/ Can someone confirm this before I go ahead and purchase. Also, if you know of a cheaper place to get it feel free to throw that out there. Thanks. I've been reading more on the website. Anyone recommend the following: clear coat, topcoat or the primer? Last edited by live4soccer7; 10-26-2009 at 09:49 PM.

10-26-2009, 09:45 PM	#17 (permalink)
874runnersr5 Registered User Join Date: May 2008 Location: Calgary, AB Canaduh Posts: 2,785	If doing anything, do por15 __________________ 87' 4runner Sr5 : 22re : 5spd : 32x11.5 BGF Km2 : Cragar 15x8 soft 8s : TG Rock Defense Front Bumper : Sirius radio : Optima Red Top : Pioneer system : Engnbldr tchain kit : Downey 3" leafs : Diff breather : Tube doors : Bikini Top Calgary Toyota Association I <3 my Toyota

10-26-2009, 10:02 PM	#20 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	Well I plan on doing it right, so I may as well get the products they offer. I plan on doing a lot of stuff on this project and down the road. So I need to get the following: Marine Clean Metal Ready Por 15 (rust preventative coating, this different than the top coat?) Primer Top Coat So 5 things total?

10-26-2009, 11:26 PM	#22 (permalink)
live4soccer7 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 431	alright... so the cleaning agents (2 items) the basic por15 and the topcoat. 4 items in all right?

10-27-2009, 03:19 AM	#23 (permalink)
tmcorbin Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Eastern NC Posts: 149	How much POR15 and top coat do you need for an entire frame, front and rear axle housing? Thanks __________________ 85 4runner 22re, 170K, clean and straight. Still working through 20 years of scheduled maint. Future plans, engbldr street RV head, cam and OS valves, engbldr over haul kit, Marlin Crawler trany rebuild kit, T-case rebuild, 2" lift, interior, repaint. Currently 20mpg, Sound great, using 1qt of oil every two days.

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